- NEWS
- SPORTS
- BUSINESS
- ENTERTAINMENT
- LIFE
- TRAVEL
- OPINION
O.C. double-dippers rake in nearly a half million a year
October 14th, 2009, 5:13 am · 237 Comments · posted by Jennifer Muir
There’s nothing like sticker shock.
That’s just what The Watchdog gets looking at the total amount of dinero county bigwigs like CEO Tom Mauk and Sheriff Sandra Hutchens collect each year.
When you add up the pensions they collect from their previous place of employment, and the salaries and benefits they accrue in O.C., they’re raking in nearly a half million bucks a piece. (More specifically, Hutchens earns $492,243 a year from her pension, salary and benefits, and Mauk gets $487,805. We’ll break down those figures later in this post.)
Mauk and Hutchens are among the other type of double-dippers working in Orange County. You might remember that the Watchdog wrote a couple weeks ago about Orange County employees who retire, start collecting their pensions, then come back to the county to work part-time.
At the time, many of you asked about double-dippers such as Hutchens and Mauk: People who simultaneously collect a pension check and paycheck because they’ve retired from one government agency, then gone to work for another. The Watchdog heard your whistle.
The practice is common among government employees with pension deals that allow them to retire young with nearly the same pay they made during their working years. And it presents prickly ethical questions for the agencies trying to fill their top leadership positions with the most qualified employees while also advocating for pension reform.
“People are gaming the system clearly,” says Orange County Supervisor Chris Norby. “But they’re not the ones at fault. The system is at fault. If we’re incentivizing people to retire early and get a pension, then incentivizing them to get a job with a full-time salary, it’s hard to blame them as individuals.”
Supervisor John Moorlach, the county’s resident pension watchdog, agrees.
“Double dippers aren’t necessarily bad people, it’s just the system has almost forced them to do it,” Moorlach says.
Moorlach says chipping away at changes to the pension system is the answer. He pointed to legislation the governor signed late Sunday night that establishes a second pension tier for many county employees, creating an older retirement age of 65 for folks in that tier.
Still, the Watchdog wanted to find out just how much double-dippers can make under the current system.
Here’s why we care: While many employees pay into their pension funds during their working years, they get a taxpayer-guaranteed check every month once they retire–even when the economy tanks and the pension funds no longer have enough cash to pay for all the pensions they’ve promised. In Orange County, the gap between the cost of funding pensions over the next few decades and the revenue set aside to cover those costs is $3.1 billion. The same situation is playing out across the state.
Double-dipping is a symptom of the broken system.
So, we looked at Hutchens and her two recent hires from Los Angeles: Assistant Sheriff Mike Hillman (pictured left) and Undersheriff John Scott. And we ran the names of top Orange County managers through The Register’s database of public retirees who are collecting $100,000 or more through the California Public Employees Retirement System. Mauk and the county’s Chief Financial Officer Robert Franz popped up.
The Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department refused to provide pension figures for Hutchens and Scott. So the Watchdog asked if they’d like to volunteer how much they collect in pension. Hutchens offered up the amount she was paid in 2008. Scott refused.
(For the record, Scott earns a total of $313,298 a year from Orange County, including $108,624 that goes toward his second pension in Orange County’s system and $7,491 toward his 401A retirement account.)
Here’s a breakdown:
- Sheriff Sandra Hutchens earns a total of $354,236 per year from the county for her salary and benefits, including $115,669 that goes toward paying her pension in Orange County’s system, and another $16,638 toward her 401A retirement account. Meanwhile, in 2008, she collected $138,007 from the pension she earned working for the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department. That brings her total annual compensation to $492,243.
- County CEO Tom Mauk earns a total of $367,541 annually from the county, including $63,882 that goes toward funding his pension in Orange County’s system and $23,546 toward his 401A. Meanwhile, he collects $120,264.60 per year from the pension he earned working for the city of La Habra, bringing his total annual compensation to $487,805.60.
(Note: Figures for Mauk and Hutchens do not reflect the five percent cut to their base pay that they voluntarily took a couple months back.)
- Chief Financial Officer Robert Franz earns $290,038 per year from the county, including $57,288 that goes toward funding his Orange County pension and $12,027 for his 401A. Meanwhile, he collects $133,744.56 annually from the pension he earned while working for the city of Glendale. That brings his total annual compensation to $423,782.56.
- Assistant Sheriff Michael Hillman earns $302,438 a year from the county, including $102,967 that goes toward funding his Orange County pension and $7,101 for his 401A. Meanwhile, he collects $150,157 annually from the pension he earned while working for the Los Angeles Police Department. That brings his total annual compensation to $452,595.
Reader Comments
Comments are encouraged, but you must follow our User Agreement.- Keep it civil and stay on topic.
- No profanity, vulgarity, racial slurs or personal attacks.
- People who harass others or joke about tragedies will be blocked.
237 Comments
Leave a Reply
You can follow this blog: on 
The county should not be providing pension benefits or any other type of benefits to employees who are already earning pensions and benefits elsewhere.
The BOS should establish and at-will employee contract that essentialy makes these people 1099 types for pay and benefit purposes.
Taxpayers getting screwed over by GED cops and fire fighters to the tune of a half million per year.
So tell me something new.
Does anyone think for one second Hutchens could make even $50K per year in the private sector with no benefits???????
I think she could me a lot more than that consulting for, or operating in, private security.
Sorry, should say “she could make”
*Please Diakosune- you need to put down the Kool Aid.
Hutchens would be lucky to be hired as a Wal Mart greeter in this economy.
If you work while collecting social securtiy your benefit is reduced. Why shouldn’t their pension be reduced in a similar manner?
Where is your twin, Johnyvegasbaby?
WHO cares OCR?? Stop beating the dead horse.
that would be great but I won’t hold my breath. an even fairer solution would be for the state to ban negotiation of pensions in union contracts between counties, cities, etc, like they do in all other states.
I care that my tax dollars are being squandered. If you pay taxes you SHOULD care also.
joe says:
You people are all knuckleheads. The “county” IS NOT “….providing pension benefits or any other type of benefits to employees……”
blah blah blah blah.
Johnny Blaze and you other morons………………………….do your homework. None of you know what you’re talking about.
==============
Joe-stop being a torugh feeder and earn your keep.
I worked for a major US manufacturing company. When they eliminate positions they often provide a ‘parachute’ as a retirement package. In order to accept that package, the employee MUST sign an agreement that they will NOT work for this company again or any of its divisions or subsidiaries. What one may do, is be hired back thru a thrid party temporary employment firm or directly as an independent contractor. You then become responsible for all your own deductions etc. NO double dipping.
I can’t understand why government lets these types of loopholes exist? When are they ever going to fix them? Let’s get on with it!
I don’t want to hear another word about how the state doesn’t have enough money for the schools, until they reign in the State of California Unions representing these civil theives!
You people are all knuckleheads. The “county” IS NOT “….providing pension benefits or any other type of benefits to employees……”
blah blah blah blah.
Johnny Blaze and you other morons………………………….do your homework. None of you know what you’re talking about.
The OCR is just trying to arouse your ire about this subject because they won’t publish the hard news. IT’S A DIVERSION, YOU IDIOTS!!
So freaking stupid……………………………………………….
Why do you care if there is double dipping? It does not increase the cost to either agency. The pension from the first agency is already vested and will be paid whether someone takes a second job or not. OC needs a Sheriff and some one will receive this salary regardless. Who cares if the same person gets both checks?
This has to stop!
Government should not be providing defined benefit retirements that are fiscally irresponsible and completely over the hill. WHO’S MINDING THE STORE?…HELLO?
WAKE UP MOORLACH!!!…NO ON IS HOLDING A GUN TO THESE PEOPLE’S HEAD. FORCED TO DO THIS MY ARSE!
IF YOU ARE MAKING A SIX FIGURE SALARY AS A GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEE, YOU HAVE THE WHEREWITHALL TO PROVIDE FOR YOUR OWN RETIREMENT!
401K’S, BUT NO MORE!!!
IT’S WAY PAST TIME TO CLEAN HOUSE!!!!!!!!
401(a) or 457. I don’t think section 401(k) applies to not-for-profit public entities.
whichever, it’s long past due.
Corrruption!
such a disgrace. I know of a Santa Ana PD officer, who has retired and they called him back on the job. He is getting his retirement plus his salary and is averaging around $60 an hour now.
Offer to do his job for less than $60/hour!
Corruption, Corruption, Corruption, Corruption, Corruption, Corruption, Corruption, Corruption!
How much longer must we endure these creeps and cronies that a obviously fleecing our HARD EARNED DOLLARS?
Don’t forget the amount of dues the Unions get out of these public employees to blackmail (to fund or oppose) elected officials to continue to approve their money moneytrain.
Gov’t employees argue that the pensions make up for earning less in the public sector. Bull!
I make less than all these folks (working in management), and have NEVER worked for any PRIVATE company that even offers a pension. And, many private companies have stopped the 401k contributions too… We are on our own for retirement, but paying for theirs.
If I knew when I was younger, I would have gone into gov’t work
Double-dipping is prevalent at the state level also.
I thought this was outrageous years ago when I first heard about it. I promote limited government and low taxes on my blog, after all.
But stop and think about it for a moment.
1.These people have already been guaranteed their retirement benefits (THAT is where the problem is… but a contract is a contract… so we need to STOP MAKING THESE PROMISES TO NEW GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES). So they retire from their old position, and get their guaranteed benefits. They are going to get those benefits whether they work another job or not. You can’t stop them from retiring.
2. There is a need to fill a position, such as OC Sheriff, or a need for a consultant, or a need for a temporary worker. The government agency can either hire someone “new” or bring in a retiree. EITHER WAY, that person they hire is going to get compensated for their new position.
Now, if you had the choice between hiring someone “new”, or hiring someone with experience, who already knows the people, programs, projects, and problems involved, are you really going to pass on hiring the experienced person because they are already getting retirement pay/benefits? We’re going to pay EITHER WAY.
The real solution will take time… simply tell all new hires at these agencies that it is entirely up to them to plan for their own retirement, and there will be no guarantees by taxpayers once they are retired. They can join together with a union or professional association that pools their resources if they’d like, but it would be entirely funded by members, NOT taxpayers.
““Double dippers aren’t necessarily bad people, it’s just the system has almost forced them to do it,” Moorlach says”
That’s a big LIE.
Like saying some guy who robs a bank is not responsible for his actions because he lost his job and somehow has to feed his family.
These scoundrels LAUGH at how they rip off the taxpayers! THEY THINK IT’S FUNNY! They clik their heels behind closed doors while acting subdued and humble when the cameras are turned on. THEY ARE ALL PHONIES. They supposedly devoted their lives to serving the citizens. But, in effect, what they are doing is STRONGARMING YOU!! They are LIARS and THIEVES dressed in official uniforms with tin badges and business suits!!! That’s all!!!
Look at that scoundrel Joanne Galinsky, the GED queen who was running a department with nearly a billion dollar budget. HOW MUCH DID SHE RESPECT YOU??? hmmm??? Busted for submitting altered documents to a court of law and lying under oath!!! Now she collects a HUGE pension and is SUING YOU FOR DISCRIMINATING AGAINST HER DUE TO HER SEXUAL ORIENTATION!!!!
HOW MUCH DID SHE AND DOES SHE RESPECT YOU, THE TAXPAYER???
The rest are the same. Same church, different pew. That’s all!
they are not ripping anyone off– they are WORKING—- you are laying around the house on welfare— big difference— I know who you are….what a laugh—
Mauk does a lot of things…I’ve never seen him actually work.
Oh yeah, I think I know you too.
Don’t you work at the Santa Anita track?
you do know me amigo— but you’ll never guess from where………hmmmmm you are a faker…..i will leave it there….hmmmmm
You’re right!! I played golf with a couple of retired OC Sheriffs, and they know they’re getting over on taxpayers. One even had a permanent disablity “ADD ON”, but he still seemed to walk the roughly 4 miles on the course and swing his clubs just fine.
THIS is exactly the thing I’ve been screaming for over a year. Look at Mauk!
He has his pension, and the county is paying into ANOTHER one for him. He has a free car, free gas, PLUS $765 a month car allowance? But the schump can’t park right? No, he has to use two spaces!
The people ripping off the taxpayers are not the front line folks making $40,000 a year, who don’t retire till they are 70 because they can’t afford to live on the $1200 they would get. No! It’s these self serving fatcats who put their buddies into cushy jobs, then retire from one and bounce over to another.
Mauk and Hutchens and all the rest should be CANNED! Not only are they overpaid gobblers, but they do a crummy job.
With the CA budget out of control, how can we possibly afford to keep doing things like this? There shouldn’t be any guarantees with regards to pensions. There isn’t magic money that we can invent when there isn’t enough. If CA has a bad year, pensioners, should have a bad year. Plain and simple, basic economics.
WHY DO U COMPLAIN NOW EVERYONE, WHY WERENT U COMPLAINGING WHEN EVERYTHING WAS GOOD IN THE ECONOMY…..
THIS STUFF GOES ON ALL THE TIME… WHATEVER
I JUST HEAR JEALOUSY… IF U DONT LIKE IT GO STAND OUT FRONT OF THEIR OFFICES AND HOLD SIGNS UP THAT ALWAYS HELPS….LOLLLL
nah no need for that, our votes will speak for us. Hutchins needs to be voted out, moorlach needs to be voted out and any one of the other criminals taking advantage of the system.
hwood: You are absolutely correct. These people are jealous, heck, I am jealous. I wish I would have gone to work for the state or the county. I don’t begrudge them what they have.
Interesting point, hwood. When I was in law school 7 years ago, everyone was saying that it was stupid to go to work for a public agency because there was no money in it. As the stock market and home prices took off, everyone was saying that pensions were stupid becuase you couldn’t make the amazing 20% gains year over year that people were making in the market.
Now that the economy is sour and the private sector is in decline, everyone is saying that the public sector is over-compensated. Now that stock portfolios tanked since 2008, everyone is saying that pensions are too generous.
My, how times have changed.
It has nothing to do with the economy and everything to do with fiscal responsibility. There is a difference. These pensions are borderline criminal. Just another form of fleecing of the California tax payer. I have had it.
You just hit the point exactly! I remember when people in the mortgage business were so proud to tell you they were “mortgage or loan officers,” because they were making mad bank back then. In the past two years, they have all but disappeared.
Good point, but that was seven years ago. How much has compensation in the public sector skyrocketed in the past seven years? That would be like saying “Seven years ago, a RN could only make 30k/yr, why go in it?” (in case you dont know, these days an RN right out of school can jump into a 60k/yr job with no experience.)
daikosune you are so right! my father recently retired after a 30 year career as a ff with l.a county fire dept. he always told me that when the economy goes a little south that’s when you will hear the crying and screaming about public employees and pensions,however when the economy is good you hear nothing and the private sector is making tons of money…well 10years into my career i’m hearing it but it will blow over just as it has in the past. i do not care what people think about our pensions and now i’m seeing first hand the toll the job took on my fathers body at 55, so anyone who has anythng to say about ff and cops can shove it!!!!!!!!
Son, this isn’t a typical run of the mill recession you are seeing here. This is the mother of all recessions. You’re not old enough to have seen tough times.
It will take extraordinary means to fix California after decades of mismanagement. And breaking up the state workers unions and their sweetheart deals will be one of the solutions. Most of these ludicrous pensions were passed in the dark of night and got no press. Guess what, the public is now aware of them and is being educated on how wrong they are. What happened to the MET pension scam is just a wakeup call.
Cry me a river about your dad. No one forced him to be a firefighter. Why are there literally thousands of people applying for every open job? Because it’s a complete racket…the amount of compensation and union protectiion for a GED level education. This is the modern day mafia…
I’m glad Hillman removed the pencil from his eye.
How typical- Moorlach protecting his buddies who are “forced” to do so. Why didn’t The Register ask how much will Moorlach be getting when he retires????
This just shows there’s as much greed and corruption in government as there is among the banks and insurance companies bilking the government for billions. It’s all one big scam to protect the ultra rich.
Meanwhile the average people are suffering. Loss of jobs, loss of companies. THIS IS A DEPRESSION and anyone who says it’s getting better soon is a liar!
OC Resident,
Did you read the news this morning?
Congress has stalled on extending unemployment benefits for the ham ‘n egger citizens.
Yet they have NO PROBLEM giving $TRILLIONS$ to the fat banker and insurance swine as a sweet bailout.
And after all the corrupted crooks of Wall Street and Capital Hill run off with the loot, Congress withholds bones and crumbs from the common, ordinary citizens who got caught up in this mess BY NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN!
And then we have these so-called public servants heisting us like never before yet acting so innocent “Gee, it’s not my fault. It’s the system’s fault” WELL THEY ARE THE SYSTEM AND THE DECISION MAKERS IN THE SYSTEM!! WHO ARE THEY TRYING TO BS???
Have you EVER heard Hutchens talk down the Public Safety Unions???
OF COURSE NOT!!! THEY ARE HER SUGAR DADDIES!!!!!
Scammers and heisters is what they are. Taking all of you for a big ride and laughing all the way to the bank!!!
I think you hurt some feelings this morning.
Ocobserver, these people are thieves and nothing less. They have taken advantage of the citizens much as the politicians have, they actually both have worked hand in hand to steal these pensions and benefits.
That gap between the haves and the have nots is getting wider all the time!
If I could get a $50,000 a year pension
I could easily retire (even in Kalifornia!)
then go be a cop. what r u waiting for?
I can’t defend Mauk, but as for Hutchins, it’s a little different. LASD employess are not part of PERS, but pay into the LACERA county retirement system. I say PAY, because when I left that agency in 1995, I was paying over $400.00 per paycheck towards my retirement (required), while making about $68000 a year. That’s over $10,000 dollars each year. Compound that over 20-30 years and figure out what my pension might have been. I’m sure Hutchins was paying much more. Is it so wrong for her to now be able to get those same dollars back in the form of a pension? How about our politicians that get lifetime medical and pensions for life, after serving limited terms. Take a look at Sacramento and Washington.
Well said ocdisgusted. We can hate Mauk and Hutchins all we want but it will NOT affect their pay. Nothing will affect it. We can only make future changes and we need to start now. If I could retire young with a great pension and then get another full time job with great pay I WOULD DO IT. And so would everyone else. And most government employees PAY into their retirement system (but not the Sheriff’s Dept) and deserve that which was promised them. Change the future and stop wallowing in the past!
When these state agencies go belly up, that’s when this crap will end. Until then, vote these pigs out.
Just to clarify on the statement that the Sheriff’s Department don’t pay into their retirement system: non-sworn personnel pay into their retirement.
Hey, retirement can be tough. Imagine having to cut back and live within your means. It takes money to live at a luxury income level.
Wouldn’t want to deprive the fat cats at the top of the lifestyle to which they are accustomed now, would we?
fix your headline….
I didn’t believe in people double dipping when Brad Gates was sheriff and am vehemently opposed to it now with the alleged state and county financial situations. Hutchens got rid of her staff that were receiving single salaries and replaced them with all her double dipping cronies, Im sure as a favor to them. Hillman, with his LAPD mentality is constatnly looking for ways to spend money they don’t have, and I understand that the others are rarely if ever seen around the shop. I always believed that all the sheriff needed was an undersheriff, and lower paid captains to oversee the everday operation of the department. All these asst. sheriifs are a waste of space and OUR money. Those pensions and current salaries are ludicrous at best. Moorlach has set out to destroy the sheriif’s department from the inside and I’d say it’s working pretty well. What a joke! Once you are retired, you should be retired! Heck, I retired from the “green machine” (OCSD) over 5 years ago and the last thing I want to do is go back to work. Double dipping simply should not be allowed, and do we really need more than 3 idiots on the BOS?
I can’t undestand why everyone is complaining. A person accepts a job, they agree on a salary, benefits and the retirment plan that is offered. If a person retires from that job and hires on doing the same job with a different company/location/etc. are they not supposed to accept benefits and a retirement plan? Reading these posts, there are a lot of sour grapes. Tell your kids to become police or fire so they can be sitting pretty at a somewhat young age and retired. Don’t blame the people who take these jobs. If you were in the same position, you would take it in a heart beat. GO HUTCHENS!!!!
What I can’t understand is how you believe this is ok???
When companies are in trouble, they often change pensions plans to ensure they are not going to go broke. Yet when public officials take money that the system cannot afford, they simply raise taxes.
We are in an economic crisis, in the private sector, when there are issues, you make difficult decisions that are not welcomed, but you do them. In THIS sector, they simply RAISE TAXES. How in the world can anyone think this is right unless they are the ones who stand to make big $$’s???
“Tell your kids to become police or fire so they can be sitting pretty at a somewhat young age and retired.”
First off, NO ONE deserves fat pension like this. The reason the cops and firefighters are getting these filet mignon deals is that the corrupt politicians gave into corrupt union demands. Does that make it right? These deals should have never ever been made in the first place.
When CalPers can no longer fund these pensions (which is inevitable), the tax payers will be forced to make up the difference. NO SIR, the tax payers never agreed to these corrupt deals in the first place. These were back room deals done between corrupt politicians and union leaders. THIS IS WHY THE GENERAL PUBLIC IS IRATE ABOUT THESE LUDICROUS PENSIONS.
Yes they were Beef!
To all you people calling this corruption. These people worked to earn their pensions and their skills are now a valuable commodity in the work force. They take another job and get paid for it. What is your definition of justice? They don’t get the pension they were promised for 30 years of service or they take on a new job and don’t get paid. Get real!
So the top cop of OC is making 500K a year (including a pension for service). That is chump change compared to what CEOs and celebrities make for doing nothing. Hell they pay some uneducated guy at GM 100K a year to bolt down a seat, who do you think is paying for that after the bailout. Bailouts, handouts and corruption is all around us, at least these people work (or have worked) for their paycheck.
Wjo cares says:
To all you people calling this corruption. These people worked to earn their pensions and their skills are now a valuable commodity in the work force.
====================
To the idiot named Wjo cares;
#1) NO they did NOT EARN these pensions, they were gifted to them under a retroactive scam
#2) The do NOT have valuable skills, they are your basic gov employee that has the brain power of a circus chimp-which is exactly what you are.
Hey dog picture guy, why are always calling people names? You need to fix your own use of spelling and grammatical errors, before you rant. Have you ever thought of proofreading? You always look foolish. I’ve seen writing from GED students that are far better than you. Maybe that’s where your hatred comes from. Give me a call, I teach report writing.
The woman takes away our CCW’s and clean’s house $$$. How proud her supporters must be.
No Problem.
Just INCREASE taxes for everyone!
I have great difficulty understanding how those who are supposed to be “models” for our society have no trouble draining OUR coffers, which only increases the ranks of our poor by reducing their incomes with the taxes needed to support these OUTRAGEOUS amounts of income these “model citizens” command.
Anyone who support what amounts to legal looting needs to get a new moral compass…..
Don’t forget that 10% raise Hutchens gave her Command staff including Hillman in June while OCEA people were getting layed off by the hundreds. Moorlach the pension Watchdog? The guy was the deciding vote to appoint Hutchens. Whichever way the wind blows I guess.
These bloated socialist pension will bankrupt California. I am keeping a close watch on this, because at some point too many baby boomer g-men will retire and our taxes will go to their pensions and not services. At that point I will leave CA for more sane pastures. As it is OC is one of the last islands of responsible living in a CA sea of liberal sloath.
When the bill comes due; the real bill payers will leave!
GED cops funny!!! I have a Masters degree almost a Ph.D, dummy..anyhow Hutchens has a Masters degree,
AND WHO CARES SHE EANRED THE RETIREMENT FROM LA COUNTY..THATS HER..SO IN YOUR REALITY DUMMIES, SHE SHOULD NOT GET PAID FOR SHERIFF OF OC, DUE TO HER MONEY SHE MAKES FROM HER LA RETIREMENT. BASICALLY WORK FOR FREE. THE PAY IS WHAT IT IS, earn your way up the ladder and make the money yourself.
lets talk about actors and the entertainment field..The reality stars on the Hills, make 90-100 thousand an epsisode. Talk about a waste of money thats being over paid.
GO BE A COP IF YOUR JEALOUS.
And for everyone of those actors making 90-100K there are thousands making a poverty wage. The two don’t match up. Making 500K in a double pension is highway robery funded by California taxpayers. I don’t fund the actors salaries. Get over it, it is simply more ripping off of the average taxpayer.
Mike with the tinhorn badge,
That’s always your comeback even knowing what a corrupted and inequitable system that YOU are entrenched in and feeding off of. hah. When you have no real justification for it you fall back on ‘well, your just jealous that I got mine and you didn’t’. hah! And you are supposed to the society’s protectors??? hah! You’re not the protectors….you’re the wolves. Really not much different than the gangs in Santa Ana that shake down businesses for ‘protection money’. Only difference is you use the unions to do the dirty work while you collect ridiculous salaries and pensions for doing unskilled labor jobs that, by definition, GED’ers can do since that is the qualifying educational level to become a county cop. Not jealous at all. As a law-abiding citizen I don’t believe in shaking down the taxpayer or stealing them blind. You are obviously part of the problem.
Yes, lets get rid of the police. Anarchy for all! Everyone will be responsible for their own protection.
Wait, what’s wrong? Your house just got burned down after being looted by a roaming gang because there was no one to stop them? Should have bought into a private security agency!
Spare the libertarian nonsense. Police officers, firemen, and other government employees work far harder and more dangerous jobs than whatever private sector job you take.
Mike with the tinhorn badge wrote:
“Wait, what’s wrong? Your house just got burned down after being looted by a roaming gang because there was no one to stop them? Should have bought into a private security agency!”
Trust me. I don’t need no copper protecting my home. In a case of civil disturbance you won’t show up anyway. We saw that in LA during the south central riots. Cops standing around with their hands in their pockets while roaming thugs were torching buildings! hah! Worthless. Nope, I am quite capable of protecting my own. I don’t need ya. If I could opt out of paying taxes for police services I would. In my experience most are worthless. Usually by the time they show up the loot is gone or there’s a dead body to cart away. All you are is report takers. Overpaid report takers.
A 7-eleven clerk has a more dangerous job than a street cop. Who are you trying to BS?
I’m not the same Mike as the cop that was also posting in this thread, but I do agree with him.
Try to protect yourself from a gang of 12 armed gang members and see how far that gets you. You can sit inside your house all day polishing your shiny guns but when it comes down to it, you probably wouldn’t be able to fend off anyone, much less rioters.
Yeah, the LA cops did a great job at fending off the rioters in 1992, didn’t they?
The only thing that stopped the riots was the post office threatening not to deliver the welfare checks at the end of the month. All the sudden there was calm! hah! And that’s the truth.
The cops did nothing. They wouldn’t even answer 911 calls. Totally worthless!
That’s why my advice is to never count on them. Protect yourselves!
You should get a refund on those education expenses…..let me see if I can be as simple and direct as necessary for you to understand…Public Employees live off of the tax paying public. Your pension is guaranteed by my tax dollars…Private sector employees are dependent on private sector performance..if their pension tanks, there is no tax paying public to bail them out. …Oh and by the way Mr. almost PHD…that’s “You’re” not “Your”….Dummy.
Oh and by the way Mr. almost PHD…that’s “You’re” not “Your”….Dummy.==============
LOL…an almost “Phd” cop that doesn’t know how to use the proper grammar, just doesn’t get any better than that!
Mike,
Did you get your Masters degree from Chapman College? Perhaps you should take some remedial classes in spelling and grammar at another school.
if you knew anything, it’s a small university, which means they have law school, business school, film school, and everything. saying Santa Ana College or CSUF is much more appropriate. have you seen some of the grads being put out by these places?
I don’t think most of these guys have the courage to be a cop— they are also way misinformed about the education level thing— while a ged is required niobody gets hired with a skimpy ed like that… my nieghbor is a cop— he has a masters in public admin from csulb….
hah, Joanne Galinsky with a GED was actually running OCSD after Carona got ousted. hah!
So that proves you’re full of bunk.
OCSD is full of GED’ers with connections.
hah!
Don’t come on the board with your bunk. We’ll smack you down everytime.
Wow, tough guy ocobs is going to “smack you down”. Just like he’s going to protect himself without any police assistance. Everyone better hope that this guy is not your neighbor, friend, relative, co-worker or close to you at anytime. What a piece of work!
No, she should not collect a retirement until she is fully retired. If she takes another job, then she’s not retired. Simple logic.
We can’t, if you have more than a GED, common sense and a clean record you won’t be hired, which explains how you got in.
not like I have a problem with all cops, just some. but that’s why they all get paper degrees after they’re in. better pay raises I’m sure.
If a person wants to work again, then why not let them. Oh and the dummies here who talk about double dipping in retirement pension and so fortth, listen carefully!!! HUTCHENS IS TAXED AT A FAR GREATER PAY SCALE THEN MOST OF US. ALSO, HER RETIREMENT IS WHAT COMES WITH THE JOB. SHE WAS VOTEDIN, VOTE HER OUT IF YOU DONT LIKE IT.
But she will probably win -re-election ibn 2010.. THE REASON SHE BROUGHT IN DOUBLE DIPPING CRONIES IS BECAUSE OCSD WAS A JOKE AND THEY COULDN’T RUN THE DEPT RIGHT. SO HSE BROUGHT IN PEOPLE WHO HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF HOW THE BIG PICTURE SHOULD BE.
CARONA PROMOTED PEOPLE OUT OF FRIENDSHIP, NOT EARNED CREDIBILITY, LIKE OCSD WAS.
Mike with the tinhorn badge wrote:
“THE REASON SHE BROUGHT IN DOUBLE DIPPING CRONIES IS BECAUSE OCSD WAS A JOKE”
There ya go. Now you’re catching on.
And since you’re part of the fray at OCSD what does that make you??
Poor Orange County! Maybe because you idiots are so far up other people’s buttholes you don’t have sense enough to monitor your local business. Let’s see, county goes bankrupt, sheriff passing out tinhorn badges, idotic board of directors sells county for a few pieces of gold, no respect for the la, wow.. My,my. I guess MWD can take a lesson from you- Don’t allow anyone from Orange county near any thing important, for they will steal you bllind. Or at minimum lie like a rug. OC,kiss me.
Hutchins was NOT “Voted in.”
She was appointed by the BOS.
Is the old man who collects social security and now works as a Wall mart greeter corrupt? No difference between them both except for the amount they make.
Maybe we should hire Carona back. At least he wasnt double dipping.
Wanna fix a broken system? Start by signing a petition that would require receivers of welfare checks to take a drug test (simply $20.00 blood test paid by the testee). Those are the people sucking our pockets dry. And they don’t work at all yet they get regular checks, totalling in the billions.
Regarding these doulbe dippers, it doesn’t cost us any more because they choose to work. If they took in their retirement and chose to stay home like most do, then someone else would hold the position and be paid the salary.
As was said earlier, it sounds like jealousy and nobody was complaining when the economy was doing well.
shut up.
You can include the $13 Billion, that we spend every year in Calif. on illegal immigrants.
Yes, lets make people who have no money and need government assistance pay for their own blood test (which most definitely would cost more than 20 dollars) in order to “prove” they are not on drugs because some spoiled upper-middle class white OC residents think that the only people on welfare are illegals and drug addicts. Have you ever stopped to think of WHY there are illegal immigrants in this state? You can point fingers at the average illegal immigrant and call them all sorts of things, but it is because of our economy and our reliance upon their labor that they are even here in the first place. They contribute more to the state economy than that 13 billion figure.
You have no clue how the real world works. You just sit in your gated community, oblivious to the outside world, decrying people that weren’t given the opportunities that you had as “lazy” and “thieving”.
Why should we spend $13 Billion a year, on people that are in this country illegally? The bottom line is, businesses want cheap labor, and they want to shift the health care and other necessities onto the taxpayer. As far as contibuting to the state, I really enjoy our lovely barrios and gangs that they brought to us.
What part of illegal don’t you understand?
Oh, I understand “illegal” perfectly. The problem in this country is with people like you who misread the problems with our immigration system and try to blame people who are of a different culture for it. It’s all a ploy to “preserve traditional culture”. The truth is, the right does not want illegal immigration to end. Illegal immigrants are a big part of our economy whether you like it or not. They do the jobs many citizens do not wish to do, and pay taxes all the same to avoid being caught. They pay taxes into a system that will never reimburse them (Social Security/Medicare).
But you’re right, enough apologizing for people breaking the laws. Lets reform our immigration policy to keep America how it was intended, a land of opportunity for all cultures, and keep our economy going with an influx of new workers.
Check this out:
http://video.google.com/videosearch?hl=en&source=hp&q=obama%20money&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wv#
runaway - I couldn’t have said it better! These whiners on here are jealous. A person takes a job, works hard for years and EARNS their pension. They move on and take another job with benefits and EARNS another pension. It is done all of the time. They are not thieves or criminals, they are hard-working honest people making a living.
Wow….our tax dollars hard at work paying these people to do absolutely nothing while we work our a$$es off every freaken day until we get to 65.
Spend a 12-hour day in a car with a cop. See the kind of human trash and tragedy they deal with every day, then come back and say they do absolutely nothing.
Daikosune says:
Spend a 12-hour day in a car with a cop. See the kind of human trash and tragedy they deal with every day, then come back and say they do absolutely nothing.
================
Don’t like it quit-see how far that GED gets you in the real world.
Public employees contintue to bleed their private sector employers dry.
Give me my torch and pitchfork!
Get it yourself
What would we do without Jennifer Muir? It’s not unconstitutional to return to work after you retire. Never has been & never will be, so if the public wants to stay stirred up by people like the writer of this article, enjoy your misery!
Obama Money,
This is where your tax money is going, stop harrassing the people who work hard and are willing to continue to work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKb78kJhaMw
The article is nonsense as usual, but at least it is written above the 3rd grade level…unusual for the “watchdog”.
I bet you are one of those people is sucking the state’s funds dry.
Don’t you mean, “One of the ones willing to answer the 911 call to your house when there is a home invasion taking place, the one willing to walk into gunfire to save you, the one willing to stop and wrestle a gun from the parolee on a car stop, the one willing to serve a high risk search warrant to keep the drugs out of the schools, the one willing to be targeted by crooks once an arrest is made, only to keep the general public safe………ya that’s us.” We’re not all perfect, just look in the mirror to figure that out.
Jan, you left out the part where you od bullets everynight!!!
We got rid of the King and the privileged royal court and replaced them with civil servants. What is the difference we still have privileged royal court only the name changed. But we can vote Hutchens out of office.
legalized theft.
As best as I can tell, the worst problem in California and the Several States is money owed by state, county and cities. . Most, if not all, can not pay the salary, benefits and retirements due public employees. This was true before the current economic contraction. And, will remain a serious problem after any economic recovery. Viva the ‘Public Employee Democrat Party Complex.’
I have a problem why folks are targeting the public employees for this practice when it is prevalent in most corporations and no one cares.
Point 1: This goes on in all other industries as an example the aerospace industry, which yes the public also pays taxes for those programs (defense etc.) yet have no problem. I have come back as a consultant due to capture knowledge.
Point 2: If a company which is basically what the public entities are ,need expertise of an individual (retired employee) because there is a void of technical or business acumen within the organization why would you not hire back the pro from dover vs. a consulting firm who know diddly and will charge even a hire rate with overhead.
Point 3: The retiree hired cost the county, city et. al. less than if they stayed due to benefits….yes these folks do not get the benefits the full time employees get it is an hourly rate / contract rate.
I think a lot of these responses are basically people who do not understand how corporations function and sour grapes…make yourself indispensable by your knowledge and hard work in the company so when you rightfully retire you can join the ranks of those who are the ones in the know vs. dead wood who left. What I find humorous are the comments that these folks are lazy and do nothing… I ask this how many of you posters are sitting at your work computer “doing nothing” but blogging on company time wasting share holder money and taxpayer money?
drewski - The difference is public employees are paid with tax dollars. These tax dollars are profits from the private sector. Right now the public employee makes 30 to 40% more than the private sector worked in wages, benefits and retirement. The number of public employees is increasing as wage, benefits to the private sector is decreasing. A system, as in California now, will collapse under it’s own weight. It is simple math.
What I don’t understand is… you leave one employer and go to work for another, doesn’t the pension just roll over? Or are they actually retiring, getting a pension and then applying for these other jobs? Wow, I know where I am going to point my children to go to work - be a public servant and live like royalty when you retire…
Each agency is different. If you work for one city and then go to another city it is different pensions. Same with the county. Each agency pays a different rate. At each agency the employee pays in a different amount into the pension. What most people do not realize is this is a government persons social security. The government person does not receive social security unless they worked in the private sector also. If that is the case the social security benefits are reduced.
Sure, they’ll live like royalty until the money coffers run out, then they can stand in the bread lines with everyone else. This is the road to bankruptcy folks.
Most cities have their pensions with PERS. (public employees retirement system). Orange and Los Angeles Counties have their own. If you retire from PERS, you can not take a full time job with an agency with a PERS pension. You can however, work 960 hours per years ( half time). Hutchens came from L.A., so she is in a new pension system now. (OCERS) She could also work for any agency that has a PERS pension.
If you retire from CalPERS and go back to work full time for another CalPERS entitiy you have to leave retirement and resume your CalPERS career until you are ready to retire. But you can work part-time for a CalPERS entity, and you do not earn benefits again. It is different if the retiree goes back to work full time with a public entity entity that belongs to another pension plan. There are no public pension laws in California to prevent such.
The problem I have with double-dipping is that there are good, qualified people out there who could fill those posstions that are a ways from retirement and currently unemployed. Any job is fairly easy to get, but a good career requires skills and abilities not just “who you know”! Gates, Carona, Hutchins….It’s all the same. Thy have all filled the top positions with cronies as political pay back and as always it comes back to bite them in the perverbial butt. I’m comfortable with my pension I received from years LE, but man oh man I could REALLY be living the Life of Riley on any of those pensions. I’d be in Aruba, Cozamel or somewhere other than still working in bankrupt California.
” the gap between the cost of funding pensions over the next few decades and the revenue set aside to cover those costs is $3.1 billion.”
What u neglected to mention is that $3.1 billion liability is ONLY if every OC employee retired at once. Obviously that will never happen. U sound like u got your #s from King Moorlach.
Also u forgot to attack our military members. They get a pension after 20-30 years of service, then usually go and get another job. That includes Generals on down.
Everyone has the same opportunity. Don’t hate b/c you made poor career choices.
Not taking anyone’s side here but let’s say the Sherriff quits her current job and just draws her pension. Then we have to pay someone else the same salary she’s getting now. Where’s the benefit to the taxpayer? Where’s the savings? The Social Security system is equally confusing. If you worked from age 20-40 in the privaate sector and then worked from 40-60 for the government you get less money from the SS. Why? because you worked for the government? You would get more money if you had stayed home and watched TV. What’s up with that? Some double dippers get screwed over.
Social Security has what is called a “Public Pension offset”. If you recieve a public employee pension, any benefit that you may get from your social security years, is cut in half.
I work for Orange County in a non-management position and they deduct over $800 per month from my paycheck for my future retirement. When I finally draw my retirement, Social Security that I earned earlier, and am entitled to, will be reduced - even though I contributed to it. There’s a law against this type of double dipping. Go figure. Regarding those who retire from one job and take another…why not, at least they’re working.
I forgot one item…why is wrong to go from one org to the other if it is allowed and legal ? Again don’t shoot the messenger it is not their fault. If the structure is such and is not changed then change it.
What companies allows anyone to collect twice on a pension just for working in two departments? If you retire from a company and start collecting a pension, they can bring you back for another job, but don’t expect another pension.
Let’s see if I got this right:
You work for one place long enough to retire and get benefits (half of which you yourself put in); then you get another job and for some reason you are NOT supposed to get paid for working that second job?
Why are you so concerned that someone is getting paid for their work? It happens all the time.
I think jealously and envy plays a very important part in your thinking.
Because the taxpayer is footing the bill….name just one company that allows a double pension for working in different departments.
Just because you’re ignorant about the structure of the government doesn’t mean you need to spout nonsense. LA County is not a “different department” than OC County. They are two separate counties with two separate pension systems. Even in the private sector, people collect multiple pensions from multiple companies.
Are you also angry that we actually pay government employees? I mean, we as tax payers are still footing the bill! While we’re at it, I’m also angry that my money goes to paying the paycheck of the people who work at the stores that I shop at! Get real, you’re using government services whether you like it or not, so you are footing the bill for their labor costs in addition to the cost of the services given. Move to Somalia or some other lawless region if you don’t want to be “burdened” by taxation.
Cops don’t have any skills to get a job in the private sector–well maybe as an angry high school gym teacher or a bouncer. Arguments that their jobs are dangerous is a farce—they are not even in the top ten most dangerous occupations. The pensions and excessive benefits are a result of an extremely powerful union and lobbyists and a non-stop media campaign to paint themselves as heros.
Retired cops often take second careers as security managers for corporations and resort hotels, Firearms trainers & teachers.
Another reason to vote EVERY incumbent out!!!
You people in OC get what you deserve. End of story !!
what do you mean, “you people”
On days like this I think of going to heaven and keep in mind the words of
Moses (Exodus 14:13) “…for the Egyptians (politicians)
whom ye have seen today, ye shall see them again no more forever.”
I understand that the media is trying to get transparency in public salaries and can report it as such. I also think that an OCR reporter who is surely making a difficult living does not have the perspective necessary to figure out why the expertise and skill of the two aforementioned professionals deserves this kind of money. They put in the required time at another job and qualified for their pensions. Then, they got a job somewhere else. If you don’t like it, why don’t you work your way up the ladder for decades and receive what you deserve as well?
My mother is a retired LA County employee (DPSS) on a pension. If she earns more than a couple of hundred dollars a month, they deduct the excess from her pension check. No double dipping allowed. How do these cops get away with it?
ocradical, unfortunately you are way off base on this one. LE now has areas of computer forensics (big bucks in the private sector), HazMat certified investigators, helicopter pilots and numerous other skills for work in the private sector that bring great salaries. Pushing a black and white is just where all have to start, then the possibilities are endless. And, I guess you have never been shot at, spit at, physically fought with both sides during a domestic violence call or struck by a drunk driver while arresting another drunk driver just to mention a few of the dangers. Just what are the top ten most dangeros jobs? Please list them with your verifiable source of information if you are going to make a statement such as that.
GED cop is not even on the top 20 od most dangerous jobsmarinevet0811, and like everyone said-it is a GED job, nothing more, like FF.
And anyone getting a $200K per year GED job is connected or a lawsuit consent decree hire……
Perhaps I should have listened to my Dad. Way back in the early 1970’s when I was entering the work force, he told me, “Get a job with the government. You will be set for life.” He was right–local, state, federal…
And ocradical, who are going to call when your homies rip you off or worse. mensarino?? No, you’ll call the police and be oh so polite to get what you want. I’ve seen hippocrites of the highest degree out there and you are no different from the rest. Unless, you just posted hoping to gat a radical rise out of someone. I just want to know your source of infornmation.
marinevet0811 says:
And ocradical, who are going to call when your homies rip you off or worse. mensarino??
=====================
And when the GED cops dont show up where do I get my refund marinevet0811???
10 most dangerous jobs per CNN(death rate per 100,00)–I wonder how many get 3% at 50
1 Logging workers 92.4 85
2 Aircraft pilots 92.4 109
3 Fishers and fishing workers 86.4 38
4 Structural iron and steel workers 47.0 31
5 Refuse and recyclable material collectors 43.2 35
6 Farmers and ranchers 37.5 307
7 Roofers 34.9 94
8 Electrical power line installers/repairers 30.0 36
9 Driver/sales workers and truck drivers 27.6 905
10 Taxi drivers and chauffeurs
Sounds more like the private sector screwing over its employees than the government being overly generous to its employees to me…
Yeah, in the real world, the “private sector” there is a thing called market wages-where the jobs are determined by the OPEN MARKET-where a GED cop would be making minimum wage-but since you live in Fantasyland your GED brain doesn’t know how to compute that.
Yes, I want the person piloting my flight to be paid the “market wage” even if it means they’re overworked and have to take on second part time jobs in order to make the bills.
More typical excuses for what amounts to modern-day wage slavery. The free market is an exercise in how much you can screw over the employees and the consumers without getting called out on it.
I wouldnt use stats from the Communist News Network. they are so left leaning it hurts
Not opposed to people having a second career or pension however, I think that if your second career will result in a pension from the same organization your overall pension amount (the two combined) should be reduced by 30%.
In addition, these outrageous pension amounts are based upon outrageous salaries. It is often based on your highest salary year. That can be boosted quite a bit by working “overtime.” Question number one is why do you pay a city manager, a police chief, fire chief so much money and why are you offering overtime? Is it a real need? For example: Professional sporting games often offer OT to police/fire. Perhaps the sports team should pay the OT and that should not go towards highest salary year. As for people at the top, yes they may be in charge of a large organization but they are not the people actually keeping you safe.
Marinevet—do you mean to tell me that I am paying 3% at 50 for dangerous work such as computer forensics and all the rest of the desk cops and beaurocrat cops like Hutchins and her cronies
Here I thought you had a credible source not an anti-police communist state run news agency. Nice try, but they have zero credibilty along with MSNBC. Oh by the way, I get 3 % at 50. Also, most of those are based on accidents, not people trying to kill you or firefighters that risk their lives day after day. Remember 9-11? How many cab drivers and fishermen were there trying to save lives while losing their own out of unselfish duty. Not to mention my brother police officers who lost their lives doing the same thing. Nope, no loggers, taxi drivers or farmers were there risking their lives helping the firfighters and polce officers. Apples and Oranges my friend!
marinevet0811 says:
Here I thought you had a credible source not an anti-police communist state run news agency
=====================
*** GED ALERT*** *** GED ALERT****
Don’t let the FACTS get in the way of your bogus lies!
If you take your pension right away, it is reduced. If you wait to collect, you receive a higher monthly amount.
If you take your pension, and get re-hired, what salary rate are you starting at. That really makes the difference. If you start at the same salary anyone would earn, it really doesn’t cost the taxpayers any more money. If you start at a higher rate because of the years of service you already put in, then it is too costly for the taxpayers to hire that person back.
I still dont see the problem , they work for that retirement , and if we hire them back as part timer , so what, many people do this that dont work for the gov.
they’re entitle to their retirement, if they didnt go back to work for us then someone else would fill the position . maybe you folks are envy
You aren’t paying 3% at 50. Most of us paid for our own retirement over the years by conributing our own money into the system. It’s like getting back what I paid after 30 years of public service saving your worthless hide and those like you.
that’s an outrigt lie. you just lost any credibility you had left on this board.
Until 1998 OCSD Deputies paid their own pension contribitions. The county later agreed to pay the pension contributions instead of giving the Deputies pay raises. The Deputies are currently offering to pay 4% of their salary into to pension fund but the county is fighting them on it.
marinevet0811 says:
You aren’t paying 3% at 50. Most of us paid for our own retirement over the years by conributing our own money into the system
=====================
GED Boy, your nose grew 40 feet with that WHOPPER lie.
#1),You had your pension raised 50% RETROACTIVELY, where you didn’t pay a dime
#2) You contribute MAYBE 10% to the rest of your retirement-it is 90%+ funded by taxpayers.
But, I thank you for any and all you paid into the system so I can sail, play golf or just sit here at home drinking coffee and enjoying reading and writing in these posts. And, thanks for the trip to Las Vegas next month so I can celebrate 234 years of great tradition at the Marine Corps birthday ball. You are awesome and I can’t thank you enough for the great life I am living in retirement.
so I can celebrate 234 years of great tradition at the Marine Corps birthday
===============
There’s the connection that got this GED dork hired- he was a military workfare hire.
Ya…..OCERS received 6.7 Billion dollars from the taxpayers of OC! http://www.ocers.org Thousands of employees pay into OCERS and you have the few JEALOUS douch-bags on here that whine and cry! The county employees are going to drain the 6.7 BILLION, ya right….what a bunch of whining pussies!
ocobserver once more weighs in without any credibilty . If not, I’d sure like to know what the county did with all the money I paid in to the retirement system. I belive I’m seeing it once a month on a regular basis. Do you have verifiable proof I didn’t pay into OCERS while working. I can only hope when my pay stubs reflected it, that’s where money went. If not, I can only thank you as well for my great lifestyle without double-dipping and my trip to celebrate the 234th Marine Corps birthday in Las Vegas next month. You are truly a giver ocobserver.
marinevet,
If you worked county public safety as you claim you didn’t pay a dime toward your retirement. Don’t lie.
Even gobblement workers who did contribute would deplete their retirement funds within 3-5 years into their retirements if they depended on those ‘contributions’ to fund their retirements. FACT. And, of course, after that point their retirements would be fully funded by the taxpayers.
You must think all of us out here live in a hermetically sealed box or fell off the turnip truck yesterday, marine.
Go buy some integrity.
hey nut! all inuities work that way….wow are u misinformed
Government agencies “trying to fill their top leadership positions with the most qualified employees”? Sure. And I have an Anna Nicole Smith paternity form that “proves” I’m the father of her kid.
In due course, the “best and brightest,” along with public-sector unions, have bankrupted the system.
Most leaders in government blindly follow precedent, leading much as the prow on a ship leads the ship. So-called management positions in government are basically highly paid clerks.
Almost everyone above entry-level is supervising someone else, which in turn justifies more management positions. In some departments or divisions, managers manage managers. The higher you go on the organization chart, the less actual work anyone does.
Do you have above-average intelligence? Great. Chances are you can handle any of these make-work or busywork jobs. What I want to know is what makes them worth the big bucks, with a killer pension to boot?
Clearly, “[t]he emperor has no clothes.”
So, Ms. Reporter - what is the solution? You’ve provided the problem. Now what? I know what I can do, but what about providing a solution to these reports?
ocobserver says:
October 14, 2009 at 9:49 amMike with the tinhorn badge wrote:
“THE REASON SHE BROUGHT IN DOUBLE DIPPING CRONIES IS BECAUSE OCSD WAS A JOKE”
There ya go. Now you’re catching on.
And since you’re part of the fray at OCSD what does that make you??
Hey dummy OC OBSERVER. and yes your an idiot. first off, it does take a GED, the reality is the job is risk on life. You could go to work on one one day and have a much higher chance then any other job, except active war areas, to not go home at night.
Your are obviously jealous,
Oh an we agree on one thing OCSD is a joke, I have too much of an ego to work there. I work out in Los Angeles handling real crime, not patrolling laguna niguel, dana point you dummy. And as far as shaking down businesses, your true criminal colors show out there. You sound like someone who has been in custody before. You don’t like cops…
Oh and USC081, typical SC private sector garbage. Yes in the private sector, you get paid more money on basic salary then cops do. Hmm lets see top step cop 8 years on, $90,000 before taxes. 700 a month to pay for my retirement, another 400 a month comes out for insurance for me and my family. So now that 90,000 is minus 8400 for my retirement and 4800 for my benefits. Thats makes it, now 77,000 and some change.
Now I have to pay some ridiculous tax for the unemloyed of 1200 a year. Now were around 75 and some change. Then I get taxed on that.
So I may walk home with 65,000 or so if i’m lucky.. Thats POVERTY out here…..
Look at wall street, look at the banks, thats robbery. To think pay a guy millions to sit in a chair and make some decisions, that any moron can make.
Mike with the tinhorn badge,
Stop with your lies and BS.
A 7-eleven clerk making $9/hr has a more dangerous job than a cop. Many more convenience store clerks have been injured or killed on the job than cops in Orange County. You’re full of it.
My record is clean as a baby’s nose. No jealousy. I probably live better than you do. The only grudge (and it’s totally legitimate) I have is paying GED grads $200000 a year comp packages and $150000 retirements at age 50. You are no better than tatooed gang thugs shaking down businesses for protection money. Same church, different pew. Guido and Marko over at the unions do the dirty work for you. You just pay them off and get your fat salaries and pensions for the payoffs. That’s the system you’ve set up for yourselves. You’re fooling no one.
Legal thievery. That’s what it boils down to. Legal thieves wearing tinhorn badges.
he is right- oc the ship came for me i n the night— i took the bean chair for demardo — is a bean a god? No— my grandma was life—get it?
OMG, the top dogs get huge salaries and double dip, so bag on the rank and file. . wth?
If all the public employees were on the same system they couldn’t double dip. Having separate but equal systems almost does force the double dipping. Even then, the rank and file troops get way less than the top dogs.
Lets blows this all out of proportion and throw away the baby with the bath water. Stupid OCR making mountains out of molehills.
ocobserver, your replies have no merit. And for oc radical. No your taxes are not paying for 3% at 50. Unless responding to these articles is your paying job. Seems like your are ripping off your employer. Maybe we should start complaining about that?
runaway wrote:
“ocobserver, your replies have no merit”
Oh, and yours certainly do when you don’t even substantiate your accusation with any reasoning behind it, don’t they!! hah!
Another GED wizard!
. No your taxes are not paying for 3% at 50
=====================
Yes taxpayers are paying these pensions, the money comes out of the general fund Einstein jr.
Tony Morrey says:
Offer to do his job for less than $60/hour!
Our Military Men and Women server for LESS at a HIGH RISK…
so why aren’t the City paying them what the Military make…
if they did they won’t do IT…..
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz old story very dull hire the best person for the job no one cares about the rest
Oh an to be a U.S senator the requirements are:
Be at least 30 years old.
a U.S. citizen for at least nine years at the time of election to the Senate.
a resident of the state one is elected to represent in the Senate.
These are the only requirements for the office that are specified in Article I, Section 3 of the Constitution.
do you think anyone would win win just the basics. GED people do not get hired nowadays..ZERO EDUCATION REQUIREMENT TO BE A SENATOR. NOT EVEN A GED..WOW!!! TALK ABOUT DUMMIES
Bunk!
Joanne Galinsky with a GED was running OCSD last year. FACT.
And look how well that worked out! hah!
And if the acting sheriff is a GED there must be gobbs of GED grads working under her!
GED grads with BIG CONNECTIONS! hah!
wow oc— please say anything new— zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
GED people do not get hired nowadays..ZERO EDUCATION REQUIREMENT TO BE A SENATOR. NOT EVEN A GED..WOW!!! TALK ABOUT DUMMIES
================================
80%+ have ONLY a GED or HS diploma at hire-another GED cop whopper shot down in flames.
Like your spooning buddy ocobs, your statements have no merit whatsoever! By the way, did you think about that proofreading suggestion, so you stop looking worse than most GED writers?
I leave the proof reading to GEDers** liek**you!
oc obs, you are nothing less than a fabricating entertainer on these posts, and give me totat amusement at my old age. I know what I paid, and again thank you for all I have and all the trips I take and for paying my slip fee in my marina. Like I said, you amuse me and are one heck of a giver. And if you are posting all this while working, you are ripping off your employer. By the way, you do know that public safety employees also pay taxes, right? Thus the only difference is that they may save your worthless hide one day while risking their lives to do so.
marinevet wrote:
“By the way, you do know that public safety employees also pay taxes, right?”
hah! yeah, with used tax money handed to you by the ones who actually turn the wheels and generate the GDP in the private sector!!! hah! You folks don’t create money! You just take it from others and spend it. You even think you’re entitled to more than the ones who actually generate the nation’s wealth to hand over to you. If you had to compete like we do in the private sector you wouldn’t have been bankrupted 50 years ago and living off welfare!!!
Yes, the government literally does nothing at all. The water district? Completely useless. The fire department? Worthless! The police department? Please…they pull me over when i’m going 100 MPH: how unfair! The schools? Who needs to give kids education anyway!
Without those “worthless” government agencies, you wouldn’t have a functioning society to make money in. You owe them for the services they provide just like you owe any other business.
More GED cop babble!
I’m not the cop, that’s another person with my same name.
I’m not exactly a perfect law abiding citizen myself (lets just say I enjoy driving a lot), but I definitely realize the importance of having a police force.
Yes, you did cheat, steal and compete in the private sector, ocobs. That’s right, we all know how honest profit making is, HAH! If it wasn’t for the criminal justice system, your greedy cohorts would not be in prison where they belong. Is this why you’re so pathetically cynical of anyone with a worthwhile pension now? Just try and live comfortable now on your tanked investments and social security, and be happy. Stop trying to blame the rest of society for your bad mojo.
I love my job. I work hard, and I do a good job.
But there is nothing that I do, even as hard as my job is, that justifies my fellow citizens paying for me to retire at any age. Strip away the politics, strip away the drama. The fact is, if I want to retire, I should save money and work for it, on my own dime, like all of my fellow citizens.
To me, the only people who should have their retirement paid for by the taxpayers are those who are injured/maimed in the line of legal duty, and who CANNOT work, whether that be military or safety personnel, or whatever. To be rendered unable to work, in service to the taxpayers, justifies the taxpayers paying for your retirement.
Everyone else? Work or save up for your own retirement.
If I could dump my union, and just work my job on merit and performance, and pay into a 401(k) and Social Security, like all my neighbors and fellow citizens do, I’d be perfectly happy. I mean, why should I ask for more than that?
To me, that’s the bottom line. No citizen can logically justify why we should get something that others don’t. Fairness…no more, no less.
That’s where I stand.
ssa, in government you are like the proverbial needle in the haystack. Or like a diamond in the rough. You have a real potential for greatness but are under the thumb of the jackbooted thugs who you work for in gobblement. A person with your belief system is self-sufficiency and competition would always hit the glass ceiling in your chosen occupation. They intentionally keep a person like you down because you threaten the scam of a system that they’ve created. When insiders start to let the cat out of the bag that’s when it all starts to fall apart at the seams. God bless you, ssa. You are the kind of person that this nation needs more of to survive. However, I think it’s too late.
“jackbooted thugs” hahaha what a cliched bit of nonsense—-oc, your are a delight! Are u still on welfare???
hahahaha OH how you amuse me observer. I Love Lucy is on right now and can’t compare with the comedy you provide. Who rejected you, the police or fire? I’m guessong overweight smoker, and flunked the psych test showing outward hostility and a persecution complex. OH NO I’M THE ONLY ONE PAYING TAXES for public safety to one day come to my rescue when I an assaulted robbed or burglarized…OH POOR ME! BLAH BLAH BLAH! Time to go to my baot and check on it due toi the rain. Thanks again for the slip payment. Oh and the sailboat. sorry I forgot to thank you for that as well. YOU are the man ocobserver!
Boat? You mean your 10 foot skiff held together with bondo that you have moored on the Santa Ana river bed?
hah.
Be sure you tie her down tonight. The rain might wash her out to sea!
hah!
Boat? You mean your 10 foot skiff held together with bondo that you have moored on the Santa Ana river bed?
=======================
hahaha…………………….marinevet0811 wont recove from that smack down
that’s pretty funny marinevet….love it
ssasherker, typical social worker bleeding heart liberal. Your family deserves the pension you have worked for. Had my fill of your kind throuhout my career. You are the reason with your thinking that abused children should be returned to their parents and continue to be abused as long as you don’t have to deal with it. SO, retire already and tell the county you don’t want your pension. Then what?
First of all? I am not a liberal. I’m fiscally conservative. My family deserves my being paid a fair wage for the work I do. I have no intention of retiring. I work for a living, always have and always will.
Secondly, I believe that most children, by the time they make it into our overworked system, have been abused for quite some time, and I think that many times they are better off with just about ANYONE but their parents.
Thirdly, if I could, I would convert everything I’ve paid in, over into a 401(k) and pay into Social Security. I don’t have that option.
Nothing you said in that post makes any logical sense. Not one iota. If you are so insecure in your stand that you have to attack people who simply disagree with your position, then perhaps it’s a very fortunate thing that you are retired.
Don’t pay any attention to the marine, ssa.
I served in the army. I couldn’t count on both hands and feet how many times we had to go in and rescue the marines after they walked headlong into an ambush. All that bunk you hear about ‘a few good men’ is hogwash. They were no better than standard army issue. My guys never walked into a battle that was too big for them. Looks like marinevet still hasn’t learned his lesson.
Wait, are you the same ocobserver, that watched from his window, while a lady was mugged in the street? I believe you said you were waiting for the police, to show up. You have very little credibilty here.
I think it’s funny. They have to attack people who are not pro-union, and who believe that the taxpayers shouldn’t pay for our retirement, because having anyone in government oppose the gravy train makes them at “traitor”. I get this all the time at work. The unions dogpile anyone who opposes their corrupt feeding at the public trough.
Look at them…what I said was simply common sense. But they will attack me as a “liberal” (hahahaha! Liberals oppose unions? WHAT?) and they will try to intimidate me.
But that doesn’t change the fact that not one of them deserves to sit on their priviliged behinds and lap up a taxpayer paid pension, and they KNOW it.
They cannot logically provide one reason that they are so very special, more entitled than everyone else. So, instead, they attack personally. *shrug*
Someone take the pacifier from Carona and give it to these guys.
ssaworker: “….so insecure in your stand that you have to attack people…”
DID YOU REALLY SAY THIS? BOY–SURE LOOKS LIKE IT!!
I seem to recall reading a blog in the “letters” column today where you called a letter-writer a MORON.
Typical liberal name-caller.
Yep–sure looks like a name-caller to me.
________________________________________________
ssaworker wrote:
Mr. Bradford, you are a class A moron.
If my daughter joined the military, I’d be more concerned about the straight men in the camp than the lesbian women. You act as though heterosexuals are perfect and pristine, and never view anyone as a “sex object”.
Facts? Heterosexuals rape, kill, abuse and molest at a 10 to 1 ratio more than homosexuals.
Good lord…people like this make Orange County look worse than the backwoods.
10/14/2009 12:40:41 PM
Recommend(1)
Report Abuse
The difference between people who work for the government disagreeing over pensions and someone insinuating that because a man or woman is homosexual that they would view another soldier as a “sex object” in the military, which might result in sexual assault or harrassment seems FAIRLY obvious to me.
But then…I have all that “liberal” education and conservative midwestern common sense.
If you can’t tell the differnce between the subjects, or liberal social policy versus fiscal conservatism, I won’t try to enlighten you.
ssaworker, you are very naive. What public employee in their right mind would opt out of a defined benefit pension to use a 401K and SS instead? Are you sure you know the difference?
hahahahahahahahahahaha
Glad you thought it was funny too, marinevet.
I won’t even charge you for it.
Don’t mention it.
Maybe Hutchens should take a pay cut instead of laying off young Deputies.
Pay cut? That would be unthinkable. She gave command staff a 10% RAISE in JUNE! So much for all the nobodys getting layed off at the same time.
I had not heard that her staff got a pay increase. That is unfortunate when she is laying off young workers who do not have a pension from a prior career to fall back on.
ssaworker wrote,
“If I could dump my union, and just work my job on merit and performance, and pay into a 401(k) and Social Security, like all my neighbors and fellow citizens do, I’d be perfectly happy. I mean, why should I ask for more than that?”
=====================================================
you can do that right now sswhiner,it’s called the private sector!! hmmm you did have a choice on public or private with your type of work yet you went the public way,hah! and how many years have you had to put up with your horrible union yet you stayed,hahhhhh!!! give me a break ssa…..
ntheoc: SSA is just another whiner, like you said. You can’t talk to these knuckleheads. They just don’t get it.
The only people whining here are the “public safety” (gigglesnickersnort) folks who think that the world doesn’t start turning till they drag their priviliged behinds out of bed in the morning.
I fail to see what is so special about any of you guys that you think that the citizens of the state owe you a living when you retire at 50 or 55. But then, my parents raised me with a work ethic.
*shrug*
Oh my….ssa you might be a moron. You should check.
Gee, Ralphie…that was a zinger! Did it take you all day to come up with that one, or did you mommy write it for you?
I worked 35 years in private sector before going into public sector.
You can only attack at me, because you can’t argue with the fantasy logic that makes you “special” enough to deserve the taxpayers of this state supporting you.
Your small yellow bus is parked out front.
yellow bus? ohhh a zinger.
The BOS gets a pension and a taxpayer funded 401K. Go figure.
The BOS has a very generous compensation package for what should be a part time job, or shudder…a position held by elected volunteers.
Many of these posts are real gems. The so called GED law enforcement employees are dumb, but they were smart enough to 1) evaluate their long term job security and income at an early age. 2) talk the BOS into the 3%@50 retirement 3) have organizational skills to pay for and run their associaions and unions. 4) Back the candidates that will back them. Not bad for a GED.
Ken,
You forgot #5 - to become professional shakedown artists.
pension = welfare
Broke by not saving and thinking of your future = stupid
These gov workers thought of that years ago– paid in and are now reaping—- stop the whining…
Fellow taxpayers, from this morning’s Wall St. Jounal.
Get ready to put on the gloves and get into the ring with these greedy trough feeders. They are coming after more of your loot to cover their shortfall. You will become an indentured servant to these louts unless to stand up and fight. They will eat steak while you eat beans and then they will stand at the microphone and call themselves your ’servants’. hah!
Not buying the BS anymore. Sorry. Time to rise up and fight back! Prepare in advance!!!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
OCTOBER 15, 2009
More Pain for State’s Taxpayers, Cities
By STU WOO and JIM CARLTON
The cost of shoring up Calpers, the troubled $200 billion pension fund for California public employees, will ultimately fall on the state’s 38 million residents, who are already dealing with tax increases and reduced public services.
The state and local governments are contractually bound to increase their payments to Calpers to help it make up for its investment losses of more than $50 billion in the fiscal year ended June 30. Officials around the state are calling for more oversight of Calpers, which announced Wednesday it was investigating fees paid by its investment managers.
Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger’s office in July asked the Governmental Accounting Standards Board, which oversees public funds such as Calpers, for stricter oversight of the funds.
David Crane, an economics adviser to Mr. Schwarzenegger, said the fund’s losses mean “there is less money for parks and recreation, less money for the University of California, less money for health and human services.”
For the 2009-2010 fiscal year, Mr. Crane said the state had to spend an additional $3.3 billion from its general-fund budget to make up for Calpers’s poor performance. The state is expecting to cover further Calpers losses in the next fiscal year as well. Those expenses add to the financial troubles California has faced in the past year, including a $60 billion budget shortfall that lawmakers closed by increasing taxes, slashing spending and raiding the coffers of already cash-strapped cities and counties.
In the Orange County city of Fullerton, officials said they were notified by Calpers in August that their city would have to pay a total of $5.5 million more in the four-year period beginning in 2011 to fully fund city employees’ retirements. The city, which passed a balanced budget in June that included a hiring freeze, has already dipped another $4 million into the red and now plans to cut employee pay by an as-yet-undetermined amount.
“The bottom line from my point of view is that just about the time we will start to see a recovery in 2011, we are going to have this huge additional cost,” said Fullerton City Manager Chris Meyer.
In Ontario, City Manager Greg Devereaux said Calpers’s woes could make it even more difficult for his Southern California city of 175,000 to provide essential services. Already, the city this year had to dip into a rainy-day fund and get its police and firefighters to waive pay raises to avoid a $13.8 million shortfall tied to a roughly 25% plunge in revenues from 2007.
Ontario’s annual payments of $8.2 million to Calpers are expected to increase by another $6 million, or 75%, by 2015 to help cover the investment losses, Mr. Devereaux said. “If there’s a shortfall in Calpers, we’re the ones who have to pay for it. And any shortfall reduces the level of services we can provide,” he said.
Other local officials said Calpers’s losses would ultimately have to be covered by the taxpayer. “I think the taxpayers are going to be footing the bill for years because of less-than-stellar decisions on investments,” said Brett Barbre, a director with the Municipal Water District of Orange County, whose employees’ pensions are with Calpers. “This is going to affect every city, county and special district that is in Calpers. They will have to cover all of the losses, as well as the ancillary issues that are being uncovered.”
Many cities are held hostage by their pension-benefit costs incurred in past years, said Mike Parness, city manager for the Northern California city of Napa. During the 1990s, when Calpers was flush with cash and charging low rates, many cities like Napa increased employee benefits to compete for workers, he said.
But now, some of those cities are finding themselves stuck with high pension costs at a time when the housing bust and recession have driven down revenues, Mr. Parness said. For example, he said that for some employees, pension benefits as a percentage of employee compensation have soared from 14% to 40% over the years. If the city tried to roll back benefits now, it would not be able to hire anyone, he said. And the city must divert any increase in revenue to pay for pension benefits instead of services. “We must change this system. It’s unsustainable,” Mr. Parness said.
Fact:
At the market’s lowest point in 2008, CalPERS assets had dropped by $100 billion. Today CalPERS has regained $40 billion in five months, and in September, its market value of assets returned to the $200 billion mark. In the last 24 years, CalPERS has had 20 years of positive returns, 16 of which were 10 percent or greater. Our Chief Investment Officer said no one knows when the markets will return, but experts believe markets are improving.
Total CalPERS Fund
Market Value
$201.0 Billion
and still going up!!!!!!
The $13 billion that we spend every year, on illegal ,immigrants, is many times greater than the pension payments. Yet, people rarely bring this issue up, when they are harping on public pensions. If we had the $13 Billion every year, think of the services that could be provided to law abiding citizens, instead of illegal immigrants.
Parness’s comments are way out of context— crap in == crap out– Cal Pers will be fine…
Check it out! http://WWW.OCERS.ORG 6.7 billion strong…. not bad for a GED!!!!!!!….LOL
I dont understand what all of the fuss is about. Sandra Hutchens worked for the Los Angeles County Sheriffs, Dept, did her time and received a pension. She is now working for the Orange County Sheriffs Dept, a totally different and separate law enforcement agency. Same goes for Assistant Sheriff Mike Hillman. He put in over 35 years at LAPD and received a pension as agreed to by his employment contract with the City of Los Angeles. Now he is being paid by Orange County. What is the matter with that. Orange County got a very experienced professional law enforcement officer. If you work for one company, retire and receive a pension, then you go work for another company, should you get your pension and benefits taken away from the first company you worked for? Get real folks.
Of course you wouldn’t understand the fuss. You’re a home teamer. You wouldn’t understand the fuss if all traffic cops were hitting up motorist for $50 pile ons. You would tell us “they deserve it. they are society’s heroes”. So whether you take it from the motorist or from right off the top from the taxpayer it’s all comes out the same in the wash. I really don’t see much of a difference between Tijuana Municipal PD and what we got here. The money just comes from different treasure pots. That’s all.
oc— man u have lost it—- you appear to be one step away from being a drooling troll out here? Are you ok? I worry about you.
Why is Moorlach complaining? Moorlach voted for Sandra and the team she brought with her.
Seems to me the blame falls on elected officials who approve contracts to hire these public employees. Unions, especially public safety unions hold city council members and county supervisors hostage by using scare tactics with their constituents. Then again, if we’re stupid enough to fall for it and continue to elect the same clowns . . .
Citizens of Orange County, you should be concerned. It looks as if history is repeating itself in the highest law enforcement office in our County, again.
Just watch the entities supporting and attaching their names to the fledgling campaign for Sandra Hutchens. If they look familiar, it is because felon Carona fed at their trough already.
What an awful mistake that lady would make if she were to be lured by the siren song of those dirty dollars. Stay tuned!
O.C. rank and file employees pay contributions into the retirement system out of their own pockets to fund their retirements. All management and safety positions pay $0. It is all picked up by the employer. Why not have all management and safety employees pay contributions out of their own pockets to fund their retirements??? The BoS claim this would be a small amount of money, but I’ll bet the amount of money the county dishes out to pay management and safety retirement contributions is in the millions.
Someone really needs to bring this issue up. Have all county management and safety employees pay their own retirement contributions.
Don’t fret! We are all going broke. Soon they will receive nil $.
As long as they are presently legal then there is nothing you can do except to push for better watch dog legislation and enact a moritorium between appointed jobs for those elected and appointed officials that are already in the system. The days that we can fork out all kinds of money for free loaders and goldbricks are at an end and it may be that legislation is needed to put and end to this type of abuse for those presently practicing this action.
Are you aware that every City, County, State, and Federal employee gets these benifits. The first 3 can earn up to 90% of their income and the Feds( according to an agent) says they get only(can you believe it) 80 % of base pay. Don’t forget the state employees include the university systems and hospitals too, road workers, highway workers, CHP, Sheriff, Local city employees, including schools, libraries, animal shelters parks, courts,parks, Police . ,teachers and so on. This is for the lowest paid employee to the highest paid and all inbetween. So you see where his is going. It used to be that public employees were not well paid so these pensions were put in place. Hoewver most public employees anre now paid higher rates than the private sector and still raking in these huge pensions. We the people need to place on ballots that the public employees retirement needs to be overhauled as was in the private sector. Give them IRA’S , 401K’S AND other plans that they need to contribute into and no more health care till they die. We the taxpayers are sick of paying all these pensions and then they go and get another job and another pension. But in the meantime, cities do not have money for schools, police, fire departments. and so forth. The Cops and Fire Depts are the biggest crooks of all. Just before they retire they are promoted(underserved) and then they go out on a disability and get yet another higher rate pension. Who are the crooks here??? My solution is that the people that have put the years in keep what they have except that the pensions do not increase after they retire. Live like the rest of us suckers. I bet they are not at all happy about their dirty little secret being exposed so much over the past few years. All new hires will come in on another plan like the private sector has. Yes a 2 tier plan. As voters and as the people that fund these pensions, I believe we will have a strong following. This includes our state legislators in Sacremento too. The people are paying through the nose and there is no money for schools, libraries, school activities and so forth. Vote out the people and have enough signatures on ballots and we will win. The free ride will soon be over and we can hardly wait. It was not fun when this changed in the private sector and now the time has come to make these huge changes and the Unions will fight tooth and nail but we are the ones with the purse strings. Get active in your cities , and counties and you will be part of saving this great state.