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Met employees blast board for abandoning contentious contracts
October 13th, 2009, 1:14 pm · 141 Comments · posted by Teri Sforza, Register staff writer
The board caved in to “fringe elements” that disseminated “lies and distortions” about the deal, workers said. They’ve been thrown aside as “vile” public opinion took over the negotiating process, and they view the abandonment of the contracts as a disrespectful slap in the face to people who work hard.
“I am proud of the job I’ve done,” 35-year employee Steve Williams told the board minutes ago. “We provide water to your agencies and we do it without asking a whole lot. We’re dedicated to this company. When they call upon us, we are there. One time it was on New Year’s Eve. There was a leak in Orange County. It was midnight…. I got in the car, and it wasn’t even our line we were working on….
“This morning when you got up, how many of you walked to the faucet and worried about whether water was going to come out? The respect that we deserve has not been given to us by the media, and not backed up by the board. Let Orange County know, we will be there. Let that be known. Let them know that you appreciate the employees that work for you.”
(Note to readers: Orange County has been singled out because The Register wrote the first story about the pending pension hike, setting off a firestorm of public opinion.)
Chairman Tim Brick urged everyone to move past the acrimony, and on toward a contract that is acceptable to both the employees and the board.
There was one happy face in the crowd, and it belonged to Marcia Fritz. president of the California Foundation for Fiscal Responsibility. In her hand was a petition signed by 2,064 Met customers, encouraging the board to reject the contracts. “I’m very pleased I don’t have to give you this today,” Fritz said. “You’ve learned that defined benefit plans are expensive risky and very complicated.”
California is one of the few states where pensions can be negotiated at bargaining table, she said. Other states don’t allow it,which ensures that public employees across agencies get the same benefits. Then she plugged the ballot initiative that her foundation is in the final stages of preparing: It would give newly-hired public employees more modest benefits beginning in 2011 - benefits “almost identical to what federal workers get.”
We have no crystal ball, but the public outrage over the Met contracts suggests that folks may be receptive to such a ballot measure. We shall see.
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Live in the now!!! As the rest of the country is dealing with layoffs and wage cuts it’s about time you do the same..
hey mike, how about when the economy was rollin and you and the rest were making 5 times or more what a public employee makes? hah, where was your bitter complaining then? where were you mike! only now do we hear you whining about deal with it, but you never heard a public employee whine about not being able to make what a pvt sector employee could make!!! go get a box of tissues and wipe those tears whiner!!!!!
Hey ntheoc -
Why do you resort to telling lies? Public Employees do not have salaries at 20% of their contemporaries.
The claim that Public Employees make less than their private sector counterparts is a myth perpetuated by unions. Don’t believe me? Go look in the want ads.
There’s no stability for anyone anymore. Public sector employees should get out into the private sector and try to make a go of it. But wait, they can’t. They can’t cope with real world benefits.
If you’re so tired of being “underpaid” in the public sector, get a real job and stop milking taxpayers.
I can say that my salary with LA County is more like 30% less than my peers in the private sector, and that’s excluding bonuses and other perks that they get.
And don’t call me a liar; check what a top-level Unix systems architect with nearly 20 years experience is making with companies like Beckman-Coulter. A friend that worked there received a five-figure bonus not too long ago and he had 8 years less experience than I do. In fact, I turned down the job he had, because I had too many years vested with LA County. I took the long-term advantage over the short-term cash.
And yes, he got laid off eventually.
If you don’t like the pay and the benefits, you are free to leave. When there is 12% unemployment and private employees pay is shrinking how can you justify a 23% pay increase? Typical attitude of the union employee. Let every body suffer as long as I get the benefits. I am sure you stay in the job for the benefit of the others…
Public employees take these low paying jobs for the stability they offer. Everything is a trade off. You can have a sexy high paying career and face unemployment when the economy downturns. Or you can take a low paying (for california) public job that offers job security even in tough times. All things in life are trade offs.
Low-level to mid-level public employees get paid BETTER than private sector counterparts. Most jobs start out at least $14-$15/hr, with great benefits including insurance, paid time off, and retirement. I think you have to be hispanic or speak spanish to get most of them , though.
Get rid of public pensions and replace them with 401(k) programs and all the whining will stop. That way the public sector can get the same “benefit” that private gets.
why don’t you get a public sector job since your so bitter at your private one! oh you probably couldn’t for some reason…you are the only one whining! hah.
Ntheoc,
bulls*t. I’ll take your job TOMORROW at current salary/pension. No raise necessary. Please let me know. I’m ready to take your place, and I’ll be perfectly happy with the current pay/benefits/pension/vacations and JOB SECURITY.
You can take my job where I’ve been hired as a temp/contractor with ZERO benefits… Not even a paid day off. Y’all suk.
ntheoc says:
October 13, 2009 at 2:51 pmhey mike, how about when the economy was rollin and you and the rest were making 5 times or more what a public employee makes?
============================
Please!…..the median pay for private sector employees is far less than gov employees-in fact there have been no wage increases in the private sector since 1999, and in the last 2 years there have actually been wage DECREASES.
And or a firehwiner like you ntheoc to make that claim is even more pathetic since your FF job compensates around $200K per year, top 4% in the nation, BEFORE any overtime is included.
So your claim that the private sector made the big bucks is pure baloney.
Hey, who has some cheese to go with that MET whine????
hah.
Spoiled brats.
These are like house burglars who feel entitled to your goods and feel slighted when they finally get caught red-handed and shut down.
Deal with it.
Welcome to a taste of the real world.
For Steve Williams,
Steve I don’t know that anyone feels you haven’t done a good job. I think the real issue here is at what cost compared to similar occupations in the private sector. Based on the O.C Register investigations and personal knowledge I would say your salary and pension are better that most people in the private sector. So a little gratitude should be in order. And many of us rate payers are very happy this was exposed and the board rejected pension hikes. In todays world you all have good paying jobs again how about some gratitude, not greed. We thank you for a job well done, but it’s imperative to look at the long term consequences. Also we thank the O.C. Register for all there hard work.
hey rick, if there is a similar occupation in the public sector that somone is trained in then they have the choice to apply or go private.. yes rick people have a choice in which way to go with their occupation if it is available in both pvt and public! seems like this is turning into a blame others society for ones personal choices if they get unhappy….
There is always some sort of comparison available. What I have noticed with respect to Public Agencies they only make comparisons that are favorable to there position. Surely this does not apply to all Public Agencies however most. I dont wish to turn this in to a blog argument however your comment about choice says alot. We always have choices always this is one consistent in our lives. As for blaming others in society again you have choices if your unhappy you can leave your current employment and seek other employment. Good luck in finding a job public or private. Or perhaps you can retrain for another career, either way you have a choice. You people just dont get it this is the wrong time to be asking for raises or enhanced retirement. Sorry if we dont agree.
A 23% raise in this economy???? 2% would be too much!!! If they don’t like it they can quit, it’s a free country. I don’t think the MWD would have any problems replacing these union slackers. By the way, how much do they get paid to have one guy working, and two guys leaning on their shovels watching?
must be nice to afford to live in laguna niguel john! obviously you are not a public employee….
Most of the worst critics have absolutely no idea what the majority of governmewnt workers actually do., but that doesn’t stop them from criticizing things they don’t understand.
That said, I have to agree that asking for a 25% pension increase in times like these wasn’t the smartest move I’ve ever seen, and makes it pretty apparent that many of us government workers are wearing an inverse set of blinders. By this I mean that we as a group need to understand why everyone is upset, identify the valid reasons for concerns (yes, there are some buried amongst the hyperbole and FUD) and work to address those valis issues.
But I would caution against flooding the legislature with hastily-conceived bills and propositions in a knee-jerk reaction. It would be better to take a measured approach and put together a solid proposal that addresses those areas needing reform in a manner that does not unfairly impact those who are not abusing the system and whose pensions are both well-earned and unreasonable.
Typo - the last sentence should read “…whose pensions are both well-earned and reasonable.
Many of these pensions are very unreasonable. How many private employers to you know who can afford to fund the entire pension for the employee. Most is a match. In some Public Agencies the entire retirement has been funded by the ratepayers for 25 to 30 years. Now thats unreasonable.
I used to live in LN. My neighbor was a firefighter and he was living high on teh hog. NIce house, new Corvette, new Mustang and he only worked 3 days a week. And he’ll be retired at 50 rolling in the money until he dies.
How’s that for feeding in the trough.
And how many times have you put your life on the line saving someone else’s property or life Mr Beef?
yep sounds about right.
Firefighters have great PR and as a result make much more than police officers. In fact firefighters are looking at a pay raise in their next contract while the sheriffs deputies are looking at a $8,000 - $20,000 pay cut.
TheJekyl says:
And how many times have you put your life on the line saving someone else’s property or life Mr Beef?
=================================
LOL…the GED cop/ff playing the “hero” card once again!
Those guys aren’t ‘leaning’ on the shovel, they’re holding it up so it don’t fall on the guy digging - safety first!
Welcome to reality MWD employees. I’m glad that you are a dedicated bunch just like a lot of us are to our employers, both private and public. I remember being called in on both Christmas and New Years a couple of years ago when my employer was having equipment failures. It’s the nature of the business. As always, if you feel that you folks are being wronged, go find employment elsewhere. A lot of us are seeing salary reductions, unpaid time off, or in some cases…. layoffs. Roll with the punches like the rest of us.
-SD
Give them the same pay and benifits package that the BOS gets. They work harder and have more training than the BOS, they should be paid more.
Take two weeks off, then quit.
To the MWD employees who griped and complained that withdrawing the pension spikes was unfair: if they don’t like it, then go work somewhere else. Better yet, try working in the private sector and see how generous the benefits and pensions are. Talk about an arrogant sense of entitlement.
Mike I agree however not all Public Employees have this atttude. Unfortunately many of them do have a sense of entitlement.
yep agreed
EVery one deserved it, They work hard they should get compensated.
Hey dude, loved ‘Married with Children’!
The bank is broke. Public employees can no longer assume that they will get what ever their unions have promised them in their negotiations, or other sweet deals that they may have been dreaming about, along with early retirement.
Amen Mike. Their hubris is gut wrenching.
“Steve Williams told the board minutes ago,….” Blah, blah, and more blah. This guy and his buddies are all heroes in their own bath tubs. Every one is a hero. Mr. Williams, if you are dissatisfied with your job - quit. Go be a hero somewhere else. Oh, and another thing. Lose the crappy looking T-shirt. It makes you look fat.
Awh…poor union thugs upset they didn’t hike water rates to pay their huge pension and wage increase????
Get a clue fools. Look at the economy. People are continuing to lose their jobs and these people are demanding big raises. This is how out of touch the left is with reality.
Finally John Q. Public is spared from the ravages of higher rates for the fat cat government worker, for now.
How many of the public sector gets guaranteed pensions? None. Be happy you get what you get Mr. MWD worker.
Just about every full time employee in the manufacturing industry gets a pension. Hell my dad retired at BOC at 42-years old. Gets a good pension and medical for life for him and his wife.
My grandmother has a pension from JC Penny, thats right, even retail clerks used to get pensions.
My grandfather was a church janitor and even he collects a pension from the catholic church.
If your industry doesnt offer pension benifits is usually because they offer a 401K and/or company stock instead.
I’ll assume you meant private sector.
Pensions are very much alive and well in the private sector for the prinicipal executives of most Fortune 400 companies.
By virtue of the fact you don’t know that means you’re not at that level.
Or just ignorant.
My Williams, times are tough and everyone has to take a hit. At least you have a GOOD PAYING JOB!
If you don’t want the job there are HUNDREDS that do.
Be glad you have a JOB!
Greedy union thugs. The economy is tanking why should we your customers have to pay through the nose to give you the inflated pensions. Most of you will just go back and work as contractors and double dip.
GREEDY UNION THUGS!
I do my job also every day. I get paid as you do. Why are you owed a HUGE pension when you retire when the rest of the world does not get it? Why is anger about this racist? I’m tired of my paycheck being completely eaten up by taxes for you people to get to retire at 55! Why should I have to retire when I’m 70 in order for you to be able to retire at 55???
Because that was the contract in place when they took the job. Don’t blame the workers for taking a good deal. Blame those elected officials and high-level execs that approved these plans.
And these pensions still pale in comparison to what the top executives in the private sector have negotiated ad had approved by their respective boards, which are comprised of top executives from other private corporations.
But the OC Watchdog ignores them; wouldn’t want to upset the companies that advertise in the OCR.
Great job, Steve Williams.
I guess since the economy is down, we are all supposed to suffer, right? So if my neighborhood burns down, but my house is spared, I’m going to torch it myself. Better yet, let someone else do it for me? NO! Back in 2004-2005 when the money was rollin’ in, so people gained, and some people gained even more. Now, many of those who prospered just a short time ago are be crushed financially. Does that mean since I stood by and watched my friends all buy F-350s, 25-foot boats, and big houses that I should suffer and react the same way? Hey, if you’re lucky enough to get a great “Public Agency” job, then kudos to you! If you’re unlucky enough to be stuck in the private sector, sorry Charlie; you were probably livin’ it up a few short years ago. The media has torched MWD’s reputation. Steve Williams is right; don’t forget how that water gets to your faucet. It rides on the backs of 2000 hard-working men and women.
Break out the violin and start playing….. “Cry me a river”. As some of the other responders said the water was there before you guys were there it will be there after and what do you know… there right !! Have a good day…
And if your in the Public Sector and remember the Public pays the salaries it can also be said sorry Charlie!! No raises nor pension hikes! As someone else posted the water will be at our taps no matter whos employed at MWD. Thats not to say I believe Steve or any other MND employee don’t do a good job, I beleive they have done a good job. However they should have to live just as all the people who pay there salaries live, lay offs, pay cuts, earlier retirement etc. There is no loyalty or entitlement.
Man… That Kate Monfort is a fat one isn’t she…. Don’t cry now Kate… better luck next time and keep cutting those department expenses…. just like all of the rest of us do… As the guy above me said if you don’t want your job there are hundreds that do…. live it…. learn it….. love it… By By kate :~)
Why become a doctor and spends years in school and sleepless nights when you can work for the state. It pays better. Boohoo, he had to wake up in the middle of the night. Please. These people get upset when they don’t get 10% annual increases. Who’s more ungrateful?
Steve Williams is a freaken whiner. Before you work there we still have water. We will still have water when you’re out dude. Your salary and health care benefits is plenty of compensation already…..stop your whining.
My dad used to say it doesn”t matter what you make or how much you spend, it only matters what you keep. Why is it we only here about how much the employees would make with little mention of how much the company would save. Twenty-nine million dollars in savings, almost double the current contracts, over five years. This was reported by an independent actuarial and is part of the public record. To help pay this, employees would have given up a 5 year medical vesting plan for a 20 year plan AND they would have began making payments into a retirement fund to pay their own way! Even the actuarial called this ground breaking for a public agency. Why hasn’t the investigative “journalists” in OC reported this. Why haven’t they mentioned that MWD did not raise rates for 7 years in a row. Or how about the 70 million dollars plundered by member agencies, like OC, from the rate stabilization fund. This fund existed as a buffer, so rate increases would stay in single digits and rate payers would be protected from big increases. This is straight from the public record but Sforza couldn’t find this? I imagine there are numerous reasons for this lack of coverage but I know of two first hand. First, these points don’t fit on a bumper sticker. Second, Sforza is a tool for disgruntled union members who will stop at nothing to keep union members and management from fighting. Oh, and before you get all self-righteous, I know some of the posters to this blog and they are far from “concerned citizens”.
Jack
You offer no explanation as to why you think these public employees should be treated any differently than people who live and work in the real world. It seems to me I read somewhere MWD employees have had there entire pension funded for how many years?. Where I live it has been since 1982 thats 26 years. How many private employers can you name who have funded the entire employees pension? Also some people may not be aware Public Employees are eligible for defered compensation up to $7500.00 per year or more. Lets take Steve Williams for instance I’m sure hes a nice guy and a good worker however he has worked at MWD for 35 years. Does he have a clue what people in the real world go through every day both employees and self employed probably not. You maybe right possibly there were some long term cost savings I really dont know but I do know something about Public Agencies and in some cases they are very poorly run. Not all of them I know some which are run very professionaly and transparent. If these agencies would post these so called cost savings for all to see perhaps some opinions may change. For now I am saying Teri and the other staff at O.C. Register did a fantastic job.
Great response to a union “looser” like Jack…. Nice job!!
It’s time for a hard audit of every single public job in this country.
It makes me sick that the govt. is the biggest employer in this country.
Go ahead and beat them up. You are more than willing to hide behind Blogs to beat up people. I dont think you have the guts to do anything else or you might have gotten off your lazy butt and made a statement to the board like those employees did.
Do us a favor and go jump off a bridge… Liberals like you should be put on an island and made to take care of yourselves. You would then see just what the private sector has to go through to keep unions and liberals like yourself fed, clothed and money in your pocket because you stole it from “us” the people who work for a living. Remember that the next time you do your taxes and/or review your pay-stub… if you have one
UPCHUCK
There is a bridge somewhere for you…..GO FIND IT!!!!
The interesting thing about people who cant compete with a good piont is they threaten and ASSUME things?
Wrong assumption #1 “Liberals like you”
Im a registered republican
Wrong assumption #2 “I stole from you”
If paying Social Security is stealing, then you and I need to turn ourselves in.
So Just remember what ASSUME does………
Then get on the “winning” team…. and stop acting like a bleeding heart liberal… Did you really want to pay 30% more to fatten union pensions… “yes” or “No”… there is no in between. Last year the MET gave away 280 mil to the L.A. coffers… and it was pissed away on union benefits, pensions and garbage “pork” projects…. Why didn’t the MET just keep the cash and use that instead fo trying to screw us for a new 30% rate hike to fatten their pensions. Do you think its right to retire with 80% of your pay check for literaly doing nothing for 20 years?? Come on guy…. see the light and come to Jesus!!!
UPCHUCK
Here is your “Come to Jesus” moment.
Go find out where the 600 million dollars the directors that make up the MET board spent in the past couple of years. I believe it the money was spent to hold rates artificially low rather than incrementally raising them. Fuel, food, you name it has gone up, not water. Now, all the sudden the rates are going to magically catch up? You seriously think that has anything to do with a pension or a contract? Somehow, I think not. Im pretty sure the rates will still go up, and there will be NO rebate, because the directors didnt do their jobs.
Once again, another piece of info that MS sforza REFUSES to look into and John and Ken are afraid to look at as it would not be good for the ratings.
Also, go find out why the board gave themselves 70 million dollars in rebates that were NEVER passed along to the ratepayers, you and me.
Dont waste my time, you cant even figure out why the rates went up.
Hey Yorba…. You never answered my last question… Also why dont “You” call John & Ken and give them your point of view…. You did not answer my spacific question of do you agree that they should get 80% of their salary when they retire after only 20 years of service… “Yes” or “No”… lets start there then we will address the rest of your drivel response about the MET.. BTW according to MDW union speaker Kate Monfort it was only 70 mil that was kept in reserve to keep the rates stable on 600 mil.. daaaa. Where do you get your info… Your right I shouldn’t waist my time with you. If you truly feel that the MWD is under paid then “give them your pay check” im sure they will accept it with an open “empty” check book…
UPCHICK,
First, as I READ it, mathematically an employee cannot get 80% with 20 years of service.The PERS site indicates you have to multiply the years of service times 2%. According to PERS, to obtain 80% under the current MET formula, you would have to have 40 years of service and assuming the employee hired in at 25, I believe that would make him 65.
So, the John and Ken speak is all you can quote, sharpen your pencil.
As far as the Rate Stabilization fund, the 600 million that was ROBBED, and the 70 million of give backs to the agencys, get your hero Sforza to go ask for the info. IT IS THERE !!!!!
Chuck,
I’m no liberal; I’ve been a Republican since 1972, which coincidentally is when I took my first government job. I’ve worked for a living since I was 15 years old and will be retiring in about 6 years. I will draw a CalPERS pension of about $750/month for 15 years there and 54% of my salary from LA County for my 25 years with them.
I stuck with government work becaue I am fiscally conservative and preferred long-term security to more money in the private sector with no pension. I didn’t create the system, but I sure intend to take advantage of it, as I will have given the public 40 years of solid, honest work.
I haven’t stolen anything from you or anyone else.
45…. I respect your work that you have done, but the cold hard numbers show many public workers that retire after 20 yrs of service are making a obscene pension. I personally have seen this.. We interviewed a city worker for a position at our firm. We required him to submit w-2’s and other docs to qualify for the position. I need to mention that this worker was approx 50yrs old and “retired” from the city… This person was no executive with the city, but a common cubicle worker… (no offense) this person if we took them would already have an $80,000.00 income coming from city retirment PLUS what they would make with our firm…. Because of the nature of our business I see this more than you know… I can not accept your account of the situation you have presented. These recent “negotations” if you seriously looked at the numbers, would entitle many who do not deserve that type of pension for what they did for the rest of their lives.. It will bank rupt the system and all of us with it. Its a cancer that needs to be removed and replaced by non-unionized workers. If you want to earn/have that type of retirement you need to have a serious degree and be doing something else besides cubicle work… sorry but its the cold hard truth..
Chuck said-” If you want to earn/have that type of retirement you need to have a serious degree and be doing something else besides cubicle work… sorry but its the cold hard truth..”
This may seem off point, but I think it is more relevant than it appears.
I don’t know about “cubicle workers”, I’m a tradesman. Why is it that a “serious degree” qualifies your for that type of retirement? If anything it just shows a devaluation in our culture of people who perform actual tangible work (i.e. craftsmen). Why is it that we think someone who has so called “serious degree” is more deserving of a guy whose mechanical proficiency keeps the wheels of capitalism turning?
Like another poster said, manufacturing and industry have traditionally provided pensions. If you remember when 401ks were first being pitched it was with the hope of long term gains in the stock market. Once they got us all on 401k plans, then they started eliminating pensions. Now we all have underperforming 401k plans and we’ve got the idea that anybody who has a pension doesn’t deserve because we don’t have it.
I have to agree with Yorba, even if the MWD contract had passed an employee with 20 years at 2.5% could only collect 50% of salary.
K Krunch
Sir, thank you for being considerate of my points and actually seeing the reality. I too am a tradesman, and fully agree that pay should be based on skills equally to education.
A shot and a beer for you!
I’d love to, but I’m WORKING. And if I’m not at work, I’m doing something constructive, like volunteering my time.
What’s your excuse?
If other states don’t allow negotiations at the bargaining table and they don’t allow it to ensure that public employees across agencies get the same benefits then maybe that says why some states have problems with police, fire, education, etc.
I’m willing to pay more for police and fire benefits than I am the water district or street sweepers. I’m not saying the water district or sweepers are not of value but benefits and pensions do draw the best candidates. I want the best police, fire, and teachers money can get. I’m willing to not be so picky when it comes to water district employees.
Now is the time to learn from this debacle and move forward, having learned some lessons.
1) The problem was not the .5% enhancement in and of itself, - the employees came up with concessions, the most significant of which but the least reported, that a two tier system would have been instituted whereby NEW employees would be required to pay 8% not into the pension fund directly but as offsets for retiree medical expenses, and the current employees would have paid 2%. The problem with that, though, the detractors were on opposite sides of the same coin. Some criticized it because they believed a two tier system was wrong, that all employees should be getting the same defined benefit. One side of coin. Other side of coin: those who distrust the union and managment alike in keeping the concessions during the next contract,
2) Even if the employees and managers had come up with some form of permanent set of concessions for the enhancement such that it would be self funded, it would not matter to detractors who are concerned about the first 2% that MWD pays (and by extension its ratepayers) and the liability that exists to taxpayers right now were CALPER to fail.
3) Labor has been seriously devalued in this country and some of those hurting in the private sector clearly believe misery demands company. If they can’t have a defined benefit pension neither should public sector employees. Misery does not want company it seems to demand it.
What to do about all this? No easy answers but ideas, of course they would have to be legally vetted, and if not possible, maybe some variation thereof within the law:
1) Require existing and new employees to pay in a certain % in to PERS to be matched by MWD instead of MWD paying the full boat, much like in private sector.
2) Institute a two tier system where new employees get defined contribution plan and existing employees remain under defined benefit, or freeze at a certain point in time where, for existing employees, calculate value of total contributions made into PERS to date andinto a defined contribution account like a 401K.
3) Support legislation to take the employers and taxpayers off the hook should CALPERS tank. In exchange don’t expect public sector employees who have not participated in social security to bail anyone out in private sector if SS tanks. For those of us that have contributed to both, pro rate any bailouts required of us based on how much of a hit we took once we got into PERS.
4) Educate the public more about what we do at MWD. We are a unique entity and a vast majority of the employees are hard working and quite talented. This “cubicle rat” tag is simply unfair to the vast majority of us.
5) Press for those that are feeling screwed in private sector vis a vis devalued labor to fight back to get labor re-valued here. Just how many products does one need to buy on the cheap? IN my condo tract, I surely see many garages just full of crap people are not using.
Remember what the UNIONS did to the Auto Industry Jan!
The downfall of the big four was a complex issue, part of it bad engineering and refusal to build more energy efficient cars, part of it increased labor costs.
The issue here to me is not whether there should be a union or not. I believe a bargaining unit is a good thing, particualarly in an organization the size of MWD. The immediate issue is what to do about PERS given the state it appears to be in and is apparently heading.
A second huge issue for me is the rather one sided reporting on this issue. I don’t think the Watchdog did a good job in reporting the nunbers in DETAIL.
Thanks Jan
I believe the OC Register Teri and staff did a great job of reporting, If they hadnt this would have pushed through MWD then all the other agencies would have followed suit. Thats a great deal for the Public Employees but maybe not such a good deal for the Public.
Jan…. you are wrong… I don’t know where to start… weather its about the unions or the watchdog group……. you are wrong… The idea of the Union was good in the 30’s & 40’s maybe the early 50’s but they no longer serve a purpose, but to extort money from the public.. Traditionally union workers are under educated, slow and fat… I see them and unfortunately interact with them every day. Why do you think that the City of L.A. wants to sub out the bursting water mains to independent contractors… Answer: they get it done quicker and cheaper. Union workers dont “hustle” they know that as long as they are in the hole scratching their ass and talking on the cell phone they are being paid… Your tax dollars and mine… paying an ass scratcher. An independent contractor comes in cracks the whip gets it done on time and UNDER budget… So you start spouting your drivel about how good the unions are and I say to hell with them… If we used non-unionized workers we could cut the cost of “all” city repairs in “all” categories by 50%… Now thats saving some money….. dont you agree… No… I know…… let the union workers do it…. Right???? My God….you make me sick
Hey ratepayers: gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, it’s mine and I want it!!!!!
These people have got to get elightnened. I think they and most government employees are simply unaware of how outsized their retirement plans are compared to their private sector counterparts. I’m sure they all work hard. Great ! So do most people. But what they don’t realize is that they are being provided a ridiculously lavish retirement benefit by their private sector customers and these customers of theirs have nothing close to what the MWD and other government employees are receiving.
This s(*&t has got to end!
See, you gobblement workers had it made in the shade for years but now you’ve pushed the envelope too far. You did it to yourselves. There was a time when civil service workers started out with bullet proof job security but lower pay and benefits (to include pensions) that the private worker. Well, now it’s evolved to a point that your average pay is higher, you have drop dead and die for pensions when the private worker juggles a 401-k and social security, you retire at 50 or 55 when a private worker is lucky if he retires at 65 and outlasts the grim reaper, you have 5 or 6 different health plans to choose from some of which you don’t pay a dime out of pocket for, you get 15-17 holidays plus excellent vacation plans…….YOU GOT IT ALL AND STILL YOU WANT MORE!
Now we’re watching you like a hawk. Everytime you try to sneak another salary or pension increase we’re going to be breathing down you necks. The water district says the the electric company workers make more than they do and try to rachet up. And then the electric company plays catch-up with you. IT’S A NEVER ENDING RACKET AND SCAM AND WE’RE ONTO YOUR GAME!
This was another warning shot over the bough. Best to take a 0% increase or actually go negative on your salaries and pensions for a few years to get us to back off. Cuz the pushback is going to get real ugly.
Bottom line: Don’t be greedy. Be happy with what you have, especially when others are losing their jobs, homes, savings and overall nest eggs by the millions. Show some gratitude. When we see folks like Steve Williams whining like a 4 year old with a runny nose it just makes the hair on the back of our necks stand straight up.
Be smart. Don’t push your luck cuz the public cramdown will be something you won’t want to deal with. I’m trying to give you solid advice and help you out.
OC, when you spout off about workers at MWD being easily replaced by Mickey Dees Workers, it does not help the debate.
So fine, some concessions appear to be in order. But what about pushing in the private sector to get things back for the average private sector worker at the same time? I have friends in the private sector that are doing the jobs of several people after those people were laid off, and they are left holding the bag working SALARIED positions for far more hours and guess what, NO MORE MONEY.
Life is too short for any of us private or public to face the propositon of having to work into our 70s or 80s. Shareholder and CEO greed has played a part in this problem. So now misery is not wanting company it is demanding it.
Dontcha think it would behoove all of us outside the top 5% ought to band together to get the pendulum back our direction whether private or public sector?? Otherwise this country will lose its middle class lock stock and barrel to third world labor.
But the MWD benefits are out of line even for the public sector. I know several people at LA County who jumped ship to work at MWD because of the better benefits. 2.5% at 60? In LA County it’s not even 2% at 61, AND there is a mandatory contribution (the non-contributory plan is 2% at 65, which for lower paid workers is actually WORSE than the Social Security formula).
The LA Board of Supervisors downgraded pensions in the 80’s to the current system. Now LACERA is considered 94.5% funded, which is excellent. While defined benefit pensions have their place (all private sectors have it through Social Security, which replaces roughly 50% of an average wage), moving to the federal model makes sense. Rejoining Social Security is a bad idea now because you have employees who have never paid in and will never reap the 35 years of work needed to have the formula work out. But the hybrid model with a 457 (more flexible than the traditional 401k) and employer contribution (of course, MWD has that IN ADDITION to the large pension), followed by a reasonable mandatory defined benefit pension and THE OPTION to participate in a contributory defined benefit system (similar to LA County’s contributory vs. non-contributory options) makes a lot of sense.
UNOBSERVER
You are so ready to bring the private sector into the municipalities? Are you ready to pay the price of PROFIT? Guess you are unable to consider what would happen if someone had to make money along with paying salaries and benefits.
Go after the MET folks all you want, and when we are paying 5x what we are now, we will all remember the contribution you have made….
YOU ARE ONCE AGAIN AN UNINFORMED IDIOT !!!!
Yorba,
If you took the time to do the math (that is, if you’re capable of it) you would realize that if you retired at 55 with 80% of your last paycheck for the rest of your natural life your personal contributions toward your pension would be lucky to last 5 years, at which time the taxpayer would start funding your pension in full.
The problem with the gobblement is that none of you are held finanancially accountable. If you screw up big daddy over at city hall throws a few more grand your way and bails you out. I know quite well how the system works. Turst me on that. At the end of the fiscal year all the gobblement managers walks into the workstations and ask the workers to find ways to spend more money so you deplete your budgets and can ask for more the next year. That is common practice. If a private business did that they wouldn’t last 18 months.
Fund your own retirement like the rest of us have to. We’re tired of carrying you.
Great reply OC Observer
I’m with OC observer.
And that’s coming from a FORMER govt. employee. I didn’t like my deal, so I took the initiative to find a private sector job that paid well, and let me use my BRAIN.
Fantastic “slap” to yorba… Im pounding on him too… This guy is an idiot!! Lets keep up the pressure. I hate liberals who claim to be Republicans… So what do you think.. is this guy a union worker or what?? Keep it up
To retire with 80 % salary, based on 2%@55 per pers you would have to work 40 years. Now to hit that magic 55 you and John and Ken keep fanticizing about the individual would have ot start working at 15. According to PERS the average age of an individual starting into the PERS system is somewhere between 25 and 30. So lets see, start at 25 work 40 years, retire at 65 NOT 55 and that means your whole contention of the 80 per cent for a guy at 50 or 55 like your KFI buddies keep telling you to say is BULL!!!!!
So, before you start telling us what a mathematical genius you are maybe you oughta take the time like I did to go to http://WWW.calpers.gov And actually read about how it works…..
I think you have the math skill problem, as I read PERS procedure, to get 80% of salary under the MET formula you would have to work 40 years for someone ot get that and retire at 55 they would commence work at 15.
Now, i think under ANY civil service organization the minimum age of hire is 18.
So, your point is, like most of your “points” pretty much baseless.
Right on OC Observer
Great “post”….. very well put!
this is what the ocr fails to report and it is the facts!
“Only 1 percent of the nearly half million CalPERS retirees receive annual pensions of $100,000 or more. Many are retired non-unionized or specialized skilled employees or other high wage earners who worked 30 years or more. Many served in high-level management positions”
———————————————————————————————
and for you firefighter/cop haters,here is more facts!
Twelve percent of all public safety members are subject to the 3 percent at age 55 formula. They would need 37.5 years of service at age 50 to get 90 percent, and would have had to start working at age 12.5 to earn 37.5 years. And 7 percent of all public agency safety members are subject to the 2 percent at age 50 formula. They would need to have 45 years of service at age 50 to get 90 percent, and would have had to start working at age 5 to earn 45 years.
CALPERS records indicate that over the last seven years, safety workers who retired at age 50 with 30 years of service represented 1 percent of all those retired. The reason very few ever would receive this level pension is that they would have had to start working age 20 to earn 30 years. Most start their safety careers at age 27, 28, or 29.
But you can buy service credit, which is applied based on one’s current salary. This can lead to gaming the system easily. For example, if you know you are up for promotion, buy years of Additional Retirement Credit the month before you get promoted. Although ARC is supposed to be revenue neutral, the retirement benefit is calculated based on the final year’s salary for most agencies, so retire when you are at top step and you can easily gain 20% or more risk free returns, above and beyond that of inflation.
According to PERS, the max service credit you can buy outright is 5 years, and even at a meager wage, is expensive.
jan duffy wrote:
“But what about pushing in the private sector to get things back for the average private sector worker at the same time?”
See, you’re ignoring a simple fundmental principle here. And I don’t think you’re a stupid woman. So I think you are intentionally omitting it from the discussion to try and pull a fast one.
You see, private businesses have a bottom line they MUST meet in order to remain solvent. And at the end of the fiscal year if the liabilities exceed the assets by a marginal amount it means it’s time to close up shop. There is NO reserve fund or public treasure they can stick their little fingers into like at city hall. They can’t force the consumer to pay more for their products to make up the shortfall because Mr. and Mrs. Smith can walk down the street and buy it at a discount from Acme Company. So giving private workers 80% of their salaries at 55 for the rest of their natural lives, free healthcare at 55, big fat salary hikes every year, bullet proof job security, etc… is a no go. THE MATH DOESN’ T WORK.
But when your people in gobblement can reach a little deeper into the taxpayer’s pocket money is simply no object. That’s why you get bigger salaries, enormous pensions, rock solid benefits, bullet proof job security, etc…. BECAUSE NO ONE ON YOUR SIDE OF THE AISLE IS HELD FINANCIALLY ACCOUNTABLE!!!!
Now it silly that I would have to explain this to you. And it’s alarming that you would try to hoodwink me and feign ignorance. I know better.
Dude, all I am saying is that pendulum for private sector jobs has swung too far in favor of the CEO and shareholder, ergo my example of friends now working 70 plus hour work weeks and not drawing a nickle more. That is not suggesting they get 80 per cent pensions.
BTW, I worked in private sector for over 20 years, coming to MWD mid career, and if I leave MWD in six years at age 58 after 17 years of service I would get 34% of my exiting salary upon my retirement. Hardly enough to sit around and eat bon bons. However, I took the job knowing that it would give me some flexibility at that age to go do something different with the pension as a strong supplement, Under the enhancement I would have got 51%. Still would only be a supplement. Hardly the 80 percent figure now is it?
What I am suggesting is that while keeping an eye on us, how about if you also keep an eye on the inside trading, colluding, third world employing CEOs and their investors that are denegrating the salaries of American workers at all levels of education and experience?
Seems to me we have clowns to the left and jokers to the right.
Jan
I agree with your comment about CEO etc. But how about this in my water district we have four superintendents earning 110,000 per year up to 140,000 per year. Out of four superintendents three had no education when starting with the district. Three now have degrees 50% paid for by the ratepayers. To the best of my knowledge when they took these jobs there were no special skills required except for one which I wont mention. For most of there careers there entire portion of PERS has been paid for by the ratepayers. Did I mention they work four days per week 10 hours per day. Did I mention they drive district vehicles and some have been known to use district vehicles for personal business. Did I mention the salaries listed do not include medical dental cost. Did I mention there retirement could easily be 60 to 70 % of there wages. With that said this district does have many good people. Some very professional others not so professional. In my area other water districts over the years have eliminated positions, consolidated positions etc. much like the private sector. This particular disrtrict has made some changes however most have been cosmetic. I think if we want to shift blame shift it to management, management continually over the years has contended they have to attract and retain qualified people. This is a legitmate argument up to a point. Then greed sets in what ever these lower paid employees get the management gets right? This is some what tragic for the agencies who have tried to be more accountable and operate on thinner budgets and staff. But you know the old saying one bad apple. And surely all Public Employees cannot fall into the lazy category. Heres another good one I recently learned although not verified that some employees here in my district if considered good employees are given a 7% increase in salary if they give one year notice upon retirement. Another retirement enhancement. If this is true this is one more thing that has been hidden from the Public and I beleive this is why you here the outrage you do when things come up like pension hikes and salary hikes. Although many people wont agree with me one of the worst things these Public agencies can and have done here is to hire a retired Colonel to manage the district. Just because he or she is a retired Colonel doesnt necsarrily mean they make good managers. To me the best they could do is hire someone who knows how to run a business and then run the water districts as a business not as Public Agency.
I agree with much of what you say, Rick. At MWD, we have lost several folks in my department, but they are not replacing any of the positions. Our budgets in my group of departments have had to come in flat for the past few years even though the amount of work has not been reduced, working harder with fewer folks.
However if we are to run MWD like a business, then we ought to stop keeping the artifically low rates and pass through the real costs of collecting, treating and distributing water to the consumers. The consumers here are not paying the true costs of water, it is artifically low. If the ratepayers think their water rates are going to decrease because this contract has NOT passed, they are in for a big disappointment. The lion’s share of costs are for infrastructure and in upcoming years they will learn this. But I guess that is a topic for another board….
If private sector employers can give CEOs $500 million a year bonuses, they can afford to give their employees a pension. End of debate.
And how many times are you gonna post lies about the numbers. You’d have to start working at 15 years old to retire with 80% at 55.
Krunch,
We are dealing with John and Ken robots, they read from the “fact sheet” and cant be bothered to think for themselves.
jan wrote:
“…….how about if you also keep an eye on the inside trading, colluding, third world employing CEOs and their investors that are denegrating the salaries of American workers at all levels of education and experience?”
Actually, that is a gobblement regulatory function as well but they did and do a rather shatty job at it, don’t they??
Point proven. Case closed.
Case is not closed. Follow the trail to the lobbyists in the pockets of big business supporting politicians Dems and Repubs alike.
So there is a huge target on MWD employees backs, I GET IT. However, don’t forget to observe the greed in the private sector dude. I sure won’t. I pay taxes and participate in this economy too.
jan you have very good points and comments so do not let ocobserver get to you. no matter what you say he will only attack you because you are a public employee. i like your take on the private sector! if only the elementry lazy ocr reporters would do some real journalism and challenge themselves they would go after those points you make,but it is much easier to go after the public employees and their hard earned pay and well deserved pensions… have you noticed that when the economy is doing good you hear nothing about your job and pension but now you are attacked mercifuly! how sad the mentality of some people,it’s like if they have cancer so should you!! keep up the good work and you really are schooling observer,it’s fun to read….
You must have some grocery shopping to do, eh ntheoc?
If not, go pull some hose at the station.
Yeah ! Only problem with you brainiacs is maybe they won’t retire so No jobs ! Ha ha, Because they won’t retire! no jobs !!! Ha ha ha you were played. KeepO up
i recommend that all of you that drink water throughout the region that your local water districts and cities whom have 3%,2.7,2.5 or 2% that if they raise your rates 20 or even 10% because the water rates are going up! you better get off your a$$es and slam them as hard as you slammed us! …. well get it when the smoke clears anyway hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha all the way to the bank! bi@ches
I’m proud of the work I do, too, but that doesn’t mean that I am somehow special and deserve to have my retirement paid for by taxpayers whose own retirement funds and economy is suffering.
No one should be able to retire at 55,60 or even 65 on the taxpayer dime, so stop whining.
God bless ya, ssa.
You are a true enigma in the eyes of your public employee family.
I sense that you are their equivalent of an ‘Uncle Tom’.
Hold your head high!
Ditto! Thanks for the post and this is exactly how I felt.
You remind me of the horse in “Animal Farm”.
The interesting thing about the John & Ken plants here is they assume that because this pension deal was pulled their rates will not be subject to the increases MET has planned.
My understanding is that this increase has been LONG coming.
Power went up, chemicals to treat went up, other costs went up and rates did not.
What they FAIL to understand is that our local water representatives did not incrementally raise rates. Rather they chose to drain a 800 million fund by over 600 million to avoid doing their jobs and raise rates.
It is interesting how NONE of the fools seem to be interested in where that 600 milllion went or why certain board members gave themselves 70 million in rebates from the same MET funds.
Maybe if ms sforza has ANY integrity she will investigate that.
But I doubt it, all she has time for is beating up government that she certainly takes advantage of, but will never admit to.
Yorba Resident
How about letting the rest of us in on what you obviously know. What fund? Who drained it? Who were the recipents of the fund? I am with you rates will go up regardless of what happened today. But I dont think this issue was as much about rates as it was about salaries and pensions! I would appreciate to hear what you know.
Rick,
I think it more appropriate that the questions be asked of the very board members who made the decisions to raise rates, drain the Rate Stabilization Fund (thats what it is called, Im told) and make the decision they did yesterday.
We have been making this all about the employees of MET, yet our local representatives are the ultimately responsible parties for all of this.
Once again, Ms Sforza, show your head and do the right thing!
MWD has a rate stabilization fund. Money that was set aside to offset increasing costs of water so the member angencies wouldn’t have to pass all the costs directly to consumers. Instead of local agencies raising rates incrementally they used the fund to offset increasing costs. Now it’s time to pay the piper. Instead of small rate increases over time, whoever you get your water from will have to raise rates by double digit figures to keep up. It was MWD that was keeping your water costs down. Now they can’t do it anymore.
Krunch,
Amen, and it would be real interesting to see how quickly the fund was depleted. I hear sometime in early 2009 there was a meeting of the board that showed the effectual robbing of the fund.
Jan. You make it sound like the District is just scraping by. Have you looked at a Board agenda or reports on Service Agreements?
And we aren’t talking about the private sector here. It’s like being pulled over for speeding as other cars are flying by. It doesn’t matter if they are speeding as well, you got caught.
As I’ve said on the the other posting, it’s a shame that the focus is on all of you instead of where it belongs. You can thank your Union leadership for that.
Nemo-The MWD board entertained the tentative contract because it apparently felt it could easily afford it. As far as the Union leadership goes, what union or employee group would turn their back on enhanced security when the board of directors of the agency says its doable? The board is charged with the stewardship of the agency, which includes the sober oversight of public funds and honest conduct. Why would these “forthright” appointed representatives even contemplate the proposed contract? should not these “leaders of the community” be aware of the current concerns of these same communities? Either the contract actually makes good business sense for the long run or the MWD board has long abandoned it’s charge and is playing politics- not just with the (dare I say it?) hard working employees, but with the communities as well. To not vote on the contract is a prime example of dereliction of duty. Send the message whether it is negative or otherwise, show some leadership or step down. yes the employees of MWD were given a slap, but you should also consider the thought processes (or lack there of) of the the officials of the board of directors. These brave souls had Kitelinger fall on THEIR sword.
Get out the violins…and cry me a river. This was the right move.
The right move would’ve been for the board to vote yes or no, not pull it off the table. Because of politics, it’s my opinion it was pulled to minimize board members exposure to backlash from voting either way.
Bad Karma Marcia Fritz. Remember what happened to Richman and his health.
You have to understand, my friend. The MWD do not consider themselves a competive business that must compete. They see themselves as the goose with the golden eggs (water) and will squeeze you dry to get what they want. hah! So they do not have to operate under the normal principles of business. They can rob and steal you blind and feel that they are entitled to whatever bounty they acquire. YOU must compete to make your living. They don’t. Look, the MWD workers have lifetime employment even if he or she is totally incompetent. The get that big fat pension allegedly guaranteed by the taxpayer (hah) at 55 while you struggle with your piddly 401-k dependent on market forces and crumbs from social security, if you live to see it!! hah. See them for whom they are. Greedy thieves and scoundrels who are parasites that live off YOUR taxes and inflated water rates but have no qualms taking MORE from you to sweeten their quality of life while you take job losses, pay cuts, reduced hours and obliterated benefits. hah! See them who whom they are. Don’t be fooled!
UNOBSERVER
Go pick up Time magazine, or go back and look at the KTLA news this morning.
The 401k system is rapidly becoming evident as a bad idea. It was mentioned in the report several times that the only realistic retirement is the PENSION system.
Now, according to the law, people in public pension systems do not pat into social security, are you angry that they arent paying into our pathetic govenrment backed system that will most likely be dead?
Seems to me that if an individual can situate themselves in a system that they contribute is going to pay them a real living when they retire and keep them off the government roles then YAY!
Dude, ratchet it down a few notches. Did some guy beat you up in high school and go on to be an MWD employee? I bet you don’t even know anyone who works for them. Take a breath and make an intelligent case based on fact and quit repeating the same misinformation over and over again. Repetition, CAPS and exclamation points don’t make your statements more accurate.
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
Mark Twain
Something that your OC Watchdog seemed to miss in her “facts” (?). As I asked before who is she really a Watchdog for? I have a feeling she neglected to “share” any of this with John and Ken.
Despite accusations to the contrary, the retirement plan for the Met’s employees wasn’t railroaded through in secret. The issue was extensively debated in open, public meetings. A recent workshop and all other Met proceedings concerning the plan were properly noticed under a state law ensuring the public ample opportunities to participate.
As to fiscal responsibility, the new agreement between Met and its unions would have produced $29 million in cost savings over five years, in addition to millions of dollars more in savings over the longer term. Employees agreed to trade an increase in their pension formula for decreases in Met’s retirement health benefit costs. Current employees would have begun to contribute 2 percent of their salary and new employees 8 percent for retirement health coverage. The vesting period to receive full retiree medical benefits for new hires will jump from the present five years to 20 years.
Employee unions agreed to other major concessions. There were no cost-of-living, or COLA, increases during the first year of the contract and effectively no COLA hike in the second year because its 2 percent pay raise was counterbalanced by the workers’ new obligation to pay 2 percent for their retiree health plan. What’s more, supervisors gave back a previously negotiated 2 percent increase and pay-for-performance bonuses were eliminated for some workers.
Most important, employees’ pension formula increase — what critics erroneously call a 25 percent pension jump — was in fact offset by the elimination of annual payouts for unused sick leave and vacation, axing of one paid holiday and personal leave day each year, reduction of Met’s matching contributions to 401(k) plans, and higher worker contributions to retiree medical costs.
I love cost savings analogy. Like the Sheriff Dept and the fire department of OC where going to save the County a lot of monies now the county is stuck with 400 billion of UN funded liability. What a savings??????
Terri,
You should be so proud of your reader base just read some of the comments.
Jan Duffy you have much more patience than I do. Thank you for TRYING to maintain a dialog.
It is better to keep your mouth (or keyboard in this case) closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.
Mark Twain
Hey Joe perhaps you should keep your mouth ( keyboard closed) I certainly dont see anything to awfully intelligent in you post
When are we going to realize that all government agency are broke, weather it ’s cities counties and our state, and water district with there under funded liabilities are broke. When are the union employees going to realize that most tax payer are taped out we can barely make it. I am retired so when my water bill increases I have to make cuts other places. The Government has informed me that in the next three year there will be no increase in my Social Security, who can I go to to whine. Senators or congressmen?I have an advise to all young people go to work for the Government or a water company, for all they have to do is raise there rates, the hell with the rate payer.
On September 29th, the MWD Board of Directors held a public workshop concerning the proposed labor contract. All financial statements released by MWD were verified, as the law requires, by an independent actuarial. A video of this workshop is available on the MWD website at: http://www.mwdh2o.com/mwdh2o/pages/board/VideoStream/index.htm
Those of you railing against the employees at MWD should take a look at this. You have only been talking about one piece of the contract. When everything is considered - cost to the district as well as employee give backs and other savings, labor costs would have dropped for the first time in 15 years. This video lays it all out. The entire contract, all the financials and impact to rate payers.
Board Workshop on Tentative Labor Agreement posted September 29th.
Quoting the MWD employees …”and they view the abandonment of the contracts as a disrespectful slap in the face to people who work hard.”
Now THAT’S amusing … the EMPLOYEES say THEY are being “disrespected” … just as THEY try (via these pay & pensions increases) to financially rape the taxpayers.
Rick, Nice grammar and thank you for making my point
Your welcome Joe and Thank You for making my point
FYI……The pay increase is not being supported by tax dollars. They are supported by the ratepayers, just as SCE pay increases are supported by rates paid by the people who use this utility. Please get your facts straight and do your own research on the subject rather than spew the misinformation that has been given by J & K and the Howard Jarvis folks.
I am wondering where Teri Sforza got wind of this story? was it from that disgruntled ex-employee and former union person, who tried to get her job back at MWD when she heard about that contract proposal? I know Teri will not give up her source while she is writing this one-sided opinion piece that she calls a news story. If you feel you are an investigative reporter, you need to cover all sides of the issue. Definitly no Pulitzer prize winner.
To Private Sector Guy:
2 words…
Pepper. Spray.
To Rick:
Good job making your point by making Joe make your point by making a point about making your point while making his point about your point being made. Good point, there.
no matter how cost effective that MWD enhance retirement is, the public will still say no, i bet even if MWD will save hundreds of millions of dollar!!! in their mind everything is set , no enhance retirement for MWD employee. they don’t care about MWD saving money, it’s all about “these people are getting something, why can’t we?”
I could only watch a small portion of the video clip. What I saw was employees whose response to the ” sane” action of the Board was to try to elicit sympathy for having done their jobs - e.g., when we go to the faucet, water is there… That is what the job is. Another got teary eyed because her department had done everything it could to perform well - again, that’s the job. The entitlement mentality is unbelievable.
As someone who retired from the private sector, in a high paying industry with, for the private sector, very good benefits, my retirement is nothing remotely close to what is in the public sector now - even at lower levels, never mind the sherrifs etc. Public employees now are very busy pullig each other up by their own boot straps. One group has edged the pension/pay program up a little and, of course everyone else points to that. If the new “standard” is not met, the response is ” you don’t respect the job we do”, “you don’t appreciate us…”
I’m sick of it, and if the news of the effects of this on cities, counties and the state hasn’t sunk in yet, we’re all doomed to een higher taxes and fewer services. All so we can prove our appreciation for groups who can retire at age 50 or 55 with 80 to over 100% of their base pay levels. Enough. And shame on the MWD Board for even thinking about this under these circumstances.
Doug Denton,
Please show us mathematically how the MET employees can get 80 - 100% of salary by retiring at 50 or 55.
Ive been to the CAL PERS website http://www.calpers.gov. Under the current MET formula, 2.0% at 55 an employee would have to work 40 years to get 80%.
you people dont get it ,it will pass eventually and there’s not a damn thing you can do about it when the economy picks up again it might take 4 maybe 5 years to get but well get it. thanks for wasting aimless time and effort and energy for nothing. losers!
Spoken like a true Public Employee why dont you go get a real job idiot.
What difference does it make how and where they got this information from. By continuing to put that out there, it sorta gives credence that there was this idea that this whole thing could be pushed through without any question.
If in fact, this was ‘leaked’, then kudos to them. They have managed to do something that has never been done, and that is to get the Board to respond. Not even the Riverside DA investigation got any tread.
The public may never know who the source is. My money would be on a current MWD employee or employees who have a personal grudge against the company or probably more accurately the union.
That would be a pretty good guess. My experience has shown that leakers are usually dissatisfied people.