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Couple shocked to find their ‘clunker’ is for sale
September 21st, 2009, 2:15 pm · 127 Comments · posted by Teri Sforza, Register staff writer
The sapphire blue 2001 Nissan X-Terra was still in pretty fine shape - but, getting only 17 miles or so a gallon, it had “Cash for Clunkers“ written all over it.
So in August, Dan Hoang and girlfriend Tara Bui gathered up all the paperwork required by “Cash for Clunkers” - registration, title, proof of insurance - and went to Volkswagen of Garden Grove to ditch the gas guzzler and replace it with a more environmentally friendly VW Jetta.
They wanted the clean diesel Jetta - which would have qualified for the maximum $4,500 credit - but alas, the dealer didn’t have any. So they went with the regular model, got a $3,500 credit, and drove away content in the knowledge that the old Nissan would be destroyed, and that they had done their little part to make the planet a better place.
So imagine Hoang and Bui’s surprise when they breezed by the dealership days later, and saw its flashing sign advertising a pre-owned 2001 X-Terra for sale. Current price: $5,995.
Noooooooo. Could it be?
Hoang and Bui did some investigating, and yes, indeed, it was the very same sapphire blue 2001 Nissan X-Terra they had owned and thought was headed for the scrap heap.
“I had come to the dealership specifically because of the cash for clunkers program, but to see that the dealership trying to sell my old car strikes me as some sort of violation of an agreement,” Hoang wrote in a complaint last week to the U.S. Department of Transportation.
“I had brought in my car registration, the car title, and 1 year of auto insurance proof for the clunker, fulfilling my end of the cash for clunkers, the other was for the dealer to sell me a new car and to destroy my old one. One of the major reasons for me to bring the Xterra to the car dealer was due to the program’s requirement that all clunkers were to be destroyed…. If I had known that the dealership was using the car as a trade-in, then I would not have brought the car in, but simply kept the car for another year or two.”
We at The Watchdog contacted VW of Garden Grove to clear this up. There seems to have been a misunderstanding.
“They came in for the cash for clunkers, but we went out and looked at the car and decided it’s a pretty clean car, so we took the car on a trade-in,” said Ken O’Donnell of VW of Garden Grove. “We decided we’re going to give them the $3,500 they would have gotten from the clunker program as the trade-in. We’re not asking the government for any reimbursement.”
Indeed, the feds confirm that the dealership did not seek money for the Nissan under the cash-for-clunkers program. Hoang’s complaint was forwarded to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration’s Enforcement and Justice Services Division, which told him this by email:
“I certainly appreciate your feelings with respect to the transaction you had purchasing your new car. Because the deal was not submitted to the CARS program for a rebate, we have no jurisdiction. However, you have the option of referring the issue to Attorney General’s office in California, or local authorities for review.”
Hoang and Bui are contemplating doing just that, but don’t expect much to come of it. “I suspect many people are being deceived,” said Bui.
It’s unclear just how often this has happened - but we know of at least one other case of a Ford Explorer heading to a dealership as a clunker, and turning into a trade-in because of incomplete paperwork.
We’ve got calls in to a couple of consumer expert types about the ethics of all this, and will update this when we hear back.
Perhaps the people who wind up buying that X-Terra - and the Explorer - will be upgrading from their semis?
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I’m glad that this dealership saved me and the other taxpayers $3500 by not seeeking reimbursement for this car.
The sellers got what they bargained for - a $3500 credit on their new car - and there is one less clunker rebate being sent out by the government. Everyone wins.
my thoughts exactly. as a taxpayer, I don’t want to pay for a perfectly good used car to be junked, which is what would happened in this case under Cash for Clunkers.
better the dealer pay the $3500 out of their own pocket than mine. too bad, so sad. it would be different if they HAD gotten the rebate, and the dealer kept the car and resold it, which would be defrauding the public. but Cash for Clunkers couldn’t go away soon enough as far as I was concerned. I see no problem here.
What this article doesn’t say is whether or not the dealership was getting the money from the government or not. If I was a dealer, I would not get rid of any of those clunkers until i got the money promised to me. It’s possible they didn’t get those rebates the gov promised (what a shocker that would be huh) and decided to recoup some of their loses on there own. If that is the case (and the article doesn’t speak to that so I don’t know for sure) I would say that’s smart on there part!
The article does say that the DoT confirmed the dealer DID NOT apply for the rebate on this vehicle.
Amen, and good for the dealership! This is what this country is built on - free enterprise.
——-
“I suspect many people are being deceived,” said Bui.
——-
How exactly were you deceived, Bui? Did you not read the paperwork you were signing?
Some people are too stupid to drive.
Bui is one of these people.
Great job VW OFGG! It seems that MR. BUI is that typical customer that myself and my fellow salespeople refer to as a “mooch” you can never make these people happy. They always want something for free. Its to the point when its my turn to help the next customer, and he or she looks like MR. BUI I turn and walk away. SAD BUT TRUE!! Ask any automobile sales professional. They might do the same.
When you say you walk away from a prospective customer who “looks like Mr. Bui”, what do you mean, Crackerboy?
Not Really! They end up loosing and the dealer ends up winning because they were sold a car for thousands and they still turn around and sale the clunker, thats make extra money and they only end up giving them $3500, they could off given them $5000 for the car. It is been sold for $6000 plus if they finance it they are getting more money so yes I feel they did get scam, why couldnt they put it on sale for $500 dollars more they went for $2500 more witch is what they were scammed for because the sales guy new what that xterra was worth thats why they didnt seed for reimbursement cause they new they were going to make money of off them.
Your tax dollars at work - can’t wait ’til the Feds are in charge of our health care! It will be such an improvement in efficiency, and they’ll cut out all the waste from the system!
This has nothing to do with our tax dollars - the dealership, the private corporate dealership - mislead these people and decided they would be better off reselling the car privately than taking whatever the Feds would give them. They took advantage of an existing federal program to get people in the door. This is what happens when private insurance companies are in charge of our health care - they are motivated only by how much profit is in it for them.
Or maybe it just shows that when you rush a new program without taking into consideration the related consequences, loopholes, etc, this sort of thing happens. The “anointed one” rushed this program through, just like he has tried to rush the health care bill. I still wonder how many of our elected officials have read that one. Maybe instead of trying to pass so many new ideas for “change”, we should slow down and really think about whether it’s needed or just publicity stunt.
**The program was a huge success. No wonder so many of y’all are having a whiney meltdown.
I’m with you on this. The program seemed like a payoff to the union auto workers. Supposedly it was supposed to take clunkers off the road, but their standards were pretty low for that. My car is older than this one and still going fine. I haven’t check the gas mileage it actually is getting but as a 98 Honda CRV Honda rated it at 22/24 mpg (the used car sales group I bought it from lied to me about the mileage it would get.) I wish it got more and that it had a 6th gear since I shift into 5th about about 45 so it should have a higher gear for freeway speeds, but at that I think it exceeds the passenger car mpg that a new car had to have to qualify. That is lame when an 11 yr old small SUV already beats the passenger car mileage.
I guess it helped the auto industry (although notice the different treatment that the dealers and their employees got than the union auto workers with their political payback on this.)
That said, if the dealer misled them and did not tell them that they planned to just use it as a trade-in, then that is wrong and they may have some come back.
Also the program benefited a few that were ready to buy a new car–not the many who might like one but could not afford it.
hey oc4truth, i think you need to read up on how the EPA rates mpg for vehicles, because i’ve counted at least 3 times where uou complain about how you were “lied to” about your crv or how your real milage isn’t what your vehicle is rated for…
iced: That’s a stretch.
Thanks Ed! Thought maybe it was just me.
So the couple sold a car, received the quoted price ($3500) and the dealer sells the car for $7500.
What is the problem? Oh, they didn’t get to feel good about saving the planet.
So they went with the regular model, got a $3,500 credit, and drove away content in the knowledge that the old Nissan would be destroyed, and that they had done their little part to make the planet a better place.
icedamericano says:
…they are motivated only by how much profit is in it for them.
And I say there is no other reason to be in business. Any businessperson who tells you otherwise, be they an auto dealer, insurance executive, or owner of the corner coffee stand, is lying.
I, for one, LIKE it when businesses turn a profit. If they had a little more of it we wouldn’t have 15% unemployment right now.
Hoang and Bui don’t own that Xterra any more. They sold it and received the agreed upon price. It’s just that simple.
Wait till all of these folks get a 1099 for the rebate monies and have to pay income tax of their free government program!
Just wait until there is a “cash for clunkers” health care program. When our bodies are too worn out, our family members can turn us in for a certain sum of money and we will surrender ourselves for disposal. This would save much from Medicare and other support-related costs.
Yes it would, why don’t you start.
WHAT?!?!?!?! You mean to tell me that there is fraud in a poorly thought out program put out by the Federal Government? How can this be?
It is not fraud in the program. They didn’t submit a claim to the program. The private, for profit car dealership committed good old fashioned fraud in the inducement by letting people believe they were taking their car under the federal program but really deciding to resell it and get the most money possible. The private, for profit dealership is only motivated by profit. The desire of the people involved and the benefit to the environment gets them no profit, so they have no value. Reselling the car gets them money so they do that even thuogh that was not the sellers intention. Private corporate fraud. Just like the private insurance companies.
Its not fraud to the Gov but it is fraud to the people. As he said if it wasn’t for the program he would have drivin the car for another year. and chances are it would have still been worth 3500 as a trade in. They should have been honest with him and said this car is worth more as a trade in and let him know they weren’t going to send it in. What if the paperwork is lost (which happens) and the DMV is never notified the car has been sold and he has to fight with the DMV on a car he thought was junked. When you drop a car off at a dealer you still need to check and make sure the paperwork is given to the DMV so that you aren’t responsible for tickets or accidents. I know other dealers were honest and let people know that their cars or truck were worth more than 4500.
They could have looked at Kelly Blue Book and determined what the car was worth in 5 minutes. I have no problem with the dealer doing this.
Don’t blame the dealership! Blame Barack Hussein Obama and his wonderfull croonies’ idea to have a “Cash for Clunkers” program. The dealerships were not getting government assistance aka. the money they were owed, and so, they must take actions into their own hands.
And today the story is “The Dealerships are Empty of Customers” after the Cash for Clunkers program. And simple economics tells us that future sales were stolen from them because of this scam. Wait till next year when even less cars are purchased.
Why do I not qualify for a new refridgerator? Do I have to go to an ACORN office to apply? I guess they will tell me how to fix my taxes, so I can get my government refridgerator.
Nearly every businessman I know will gladly trade a future sale for a sale today, and cross the next bridge when he or she gets to it.
All the dealer I spoke to weren’t thrilled with the program, said that the wait for the money is a joke. They were running out of cars and people wern’t getting what they wanted. The dealers all said they want the sales but knew they might lose their jobs in the next 6 months.
” I don no wha hoppen ?!” Please.
this is excelent! destroying cars is stupid. im glad that car is for sale, that dealership is a hero. now lets file charges against those who benefited from CARS for theft. and im serious.
having a car dealership for a hero is like having Hitler as a role model. aim low, my friends.
What a moronic statement!
I think that is funny.
So the dealer gave these people $3,500 off the inflated price of their new vehicle and are selling their old car for twice as much. This happens at car dealers every day. The only fresh aspect of this story is how the federal government is helping these car dealers bring in new suckers. Horray, government!
The dealership did that because of the length of time that it takes to get a rebate from Obama! I have friends who are car dealers and they say that the CFC program is a joke!
Nobody forced them to participate. I didn’t see too many dealers advertising that they weren’t participating in the program. Who are these guys who didn’t take advantage, I wonder?
Of course it’s a joke…..and a scam as well! Just like everything else the federal gov’t gets involved with. And they wonder why there is growing contempt and distrust of those fools!
Sounds like a bate and switch scheme.
The sellers went in with the intent to purchase a qualified clunker substitute VW Jetta Diesel at the best rebate price of $4500.
The dealer could have special ordered or checked other dealers for the Jetta Diesel, but instead they tricked the buyers into a Jetta Gasoline and not notifying the buyers that this was not a clunker rebate the buyers lost $1000 in savings and the dealer has put another clunker on the road.
they could have walked out, or called any one of another 40+ VW dealerships within Southern Cal. most manufacturers’ websites even allow you to search for a certain car in dealer inventory yourself, though they definitely could have insisted the dealer provide this service for them.
it was their consenting decision to purchase the gasoline-powered Jetta for $3500 less than the sticker.
I did the cash for clunker program because my SUV got 14 miles per gallon and was only worth 1800. After picking the car I wanted I found out their was only 6 in LA, Orange County and San Deigo. All six were so jacked up in price that I ended up getting a another car than what I wanted. –So the couple thought their car was only worth the Cash for Clunkers program, if the dealer had been honest, they would have told them to come back a couple of weeks and get the car they wanted and given them the trade in value.
I’m upset to learn that not one, but two SUVs were not destroyed when there was a perfect opportunity to do so.
Welcome to the real world. It’s a known fact that car dealerships make most of their money by selling used cars…many of them are trade ins.
People don’t want to go through the hassle of selling the car themselves, so they basically give it away to the dealership. The dealer cleans the car up and lists it for double what they paid for it. Like was mentioned above…this happens everyday.
If the pictured car above is considered a clunker, we are in big trouble. This car could be reliable transportation for someone for years to come.
Can’t wait for the Federal Government to take over Health Insurance. Take a look at Medicare for a preview.
you got your 3500. let it go you morons.. let the dealer survive and save our resources. why would you destroy a car.
NOT SUPRISED
I think a few people are missing the point that the government did not pay for this car. There was no fraud here.
There would be fraud if the dealer was paid for the car by the government and resold the car. That should be punished.
I’m also sick to think that cars as nice as the one pictured would be “cluckers” and that our government was paying to destroy them. The article said that it got 17 mpg. That’s pretty damn good. Most passenger cars only get about 20 mpg.
Oh, yeah? Not sure where you get your figures. My 98 Honda CRV small SUV was rated at 22/24. Not sure if it is actually getting that, but this is a small 4WD SUV that exceeds the standards for the new cars to be substituted for the “clunkers.”
Yeah, I guess they are moving people to cars that get a little bit better gas mileage but it seems that people could have done that on their own and just gotten a trade in to get a more fuel efficent car or sold in on Auto Trader or something. But basically calling it cash for clunkers was a farce. If the goal was really to improve gas mileage of the cars on the road, they should have had stricter standards. Probably most newer cars would get better gas mileage than comparable older cars.
Sounds like they didn’t get the deal in writing.
What??? A car salesman and a dealership wasn’t up front and honest? They mislead a customer? How could that be?
My world is officially shaken!
The couple turned in a car worth MORE than the CFC program was offering (fools), instead of maximizing the value of the vehicle through a private sale. Then to make matters worse, they are disuaded away from buying the car they originally went in the dealership to purchase.
How can you possibly feel sorry for someone that dumb?
According to KBB, the car is worth less than $2K trade in. It’s got over 140K miles. I doubt they would’ve gotten much more.
hahahaaha, and they have it up for sale for over $7000…the new owner of that vehicle would have even got more screwed………..
I agree, I don’t care much for the cash for clunkers program, but this dealership just does what every dealership does,,,,,lie and deceit to earn a buck…
this has nothing to do with the federal program being a sham…if they have such a hard time getting their funds, then they should never never ever use that program as a reason to sell a car…unethical, dishonest and another reason I hope they (the dealership) go bankrupt
I mean the new vehicle owner ..for the first sentence.
What’s the beef? Buyer got money for the car and Dealer didn’t request money from Gov. Move on people.
yay! its called capitalism ! it works.
Amen to that!
as if a Jetta won’t be headed for the metal heap in a few years…
CFC is a joke, then healthcare reform is a disaster…. Where does Gov. get money? From taxpayers, and pay for government wasting resources. Obama and democrates see the taxpayers like chicken’s golden eggs, just squize them and they get what they want.
I wonder what Jetta they got that didn’t get enough MPG to qualify for the 4500 instead of just 3500. That is also pretty shady work on the part of the dealer, since they came in looking to get the 4500, the deal may have swindled them down to the 3500 since they had in mind not to trash the car.
True, my SUV got better milage than that and I got another SUV and still got 4500 off. All Jetta get much better milage than a Nissan Xterra and they should have got the max amount. They got screwed
Doesn’t sound like anything here is news…no fraud, no problem. The dealership may have been a little more clear about the status of the trade in but I’ll bet if Dan or Tara looked at the paperwork it would not say anything about Cash for Clunkers. The X-Tera isn’t going to a landfill and that’s OK with me.
I would have given them $3,600 for it.
If they are really so upset about the SUV not being destroyed because they are so “envirnonmentally minded” …. Maybe they should have bought a hybrid or not settled for a gas model when they wanted diesel. If these people aren’t smart enough to know that there are other dealers and other more gas efficient cars than the one they settled for… they probably weren’t smart enough to understand that the deal was being done as a trade in and not a CFC deal. I’d be willing to bet they were told but it didn’t sink in. They should be happy… now some family who can’t afford a new car will have the opportunity to purchase a good used car.
If they are really so gung ho about destroying the SUV… here’s an alternative… Destroy the new Jetta and start riding a bike.
They aren’t environmentalists. If they were, they would not have waited for CFC. And, they would have stuck to the idea of buying the cleaner car they wanted rather than what was available at the dealership at the time.
Sounds more like they wanted 15 mins.
dealerships employee’s are fraud…is’nt that right Saturn of Whittier?
Shady, but dealerships are all about shady deals and less-than-full disclosure. Unless you know what you are doing, the dealership will take advantage of you.
Some serious ignorance with some of these posts. The dealership acted as they saw fit, don’t blame the government. The government is trying to HELP America and the environment by introducing programs like cash for clunkers. Ignorant Republicans that blame everything on Obama and the government b/c they have preconceived notions.
YOUR CREATING A MORE DIVIDED COUNTRY!
The dealership made the choice and gave the people a deal, what’s the problem?
Again, if this was really about helping the environment why not have higher standards for fuel economy for the new, substitute vehicles? When my 11 yr old vehicle gets good enough gas mileage to beat the new standards what does that say about them really trying to help the environment? That part is a farce. Its pay off to the union auto workers.
IF any of you believe this b.s. … you’re all morons!
this is the biggest scam EVER for dealers.. Who ARE one step above Dog Breeder / Traders.. Wake up! they’re stealing for both the customer and the government! WAKE UP>
I’m not surprised. I was at a parts store in LA and i saw a car with the word “clunker” on the windshield. They didn’t even bother taking it off.
you went to a parts store, as long as the engine and transmission is missing, then there is nothing wrong with this.
The dealership wasn’t very clear on what the transaction really was. The couple got the short end of the stick. Volkswagon Jetta TDI’s are a joke, we have a ‘06 (purchased new) that only made it to 103,000 miles before it sucked a glow plug and completely ruined the engine and turbo! Ours was backed by the extra extended warranty and all the dealership and Volkswagon would do to make it right was chuckle and say “sorry”. Glowplugs not covered by warranty. No more Volkswagons for this family, they are a joke. Just remember this; automobile dealerships are not very well known for their honesty.
Try a Toyota or Honda. I’ve had Toyotas that were still doing pretty well after over 10 years and over 135k miles. my 98 Honda CRV is still going strong with probably around 118k miles on it. And it was rated at 22/24. I wish it were better but that is better than the newer XTerra they traded in.
CARS program goverment SCAM
“The sapphire blue 2001 Nissan X-Terra was still in pretty fine shape - but, getting only 17 miles or so a gallon, it had “Cash for Clunkers“ written all over it.”
What??!! Since when is a 17 MPG 2001 Nissan SUV a clunker? The “enviromentally friendly” ‘09 Jetta gets 21 MPG. What greedy opportunists!
Too many vultures gorging off the same taxpayer carcass!
Lets see, 4 mph better. I think I read that was the minimum to qualify. Sure not very much when much older cars could already beat that.
I guess they wanted to feel good about “doing something for the environment” without really bothering to check how much good they might be doing. And if the car were destroyed, sure it uses more gas than newer ones, but how much of it could be re-cycled? Better to use things longer to keep them out of landfills longer.
I guess the less literate here seem to think that if a private businessman deceives or misleads you, it is the fault of some government agency and Obama specifically.
You mean the paranoid among us are irrational? What will happen next? A car dealer scamming the public? Will wonders never cease!
And I love the comment above about how capitalism works? Yes, when it is not destroying the financial infrastructure, when it is not ripping you off buying a car, when it is not charging you endless “fees” or hidden charges (see Banking, Telecommunications, Cable, etc.) , when it is not making billions off the sweat of the many for benefit of the few; yeah I guess you can say capitalism works!
Well capitalism also gives many individuals the opportunity to go in business for themselves and to rise as high as they are able to.
How about govt destroying financial infrastructure by pushing to open up home ownership to more people by loosening lending standards? And then the lenders and all realized there was money to be made now and jumped on the bandwagon to get theirs while the getting was good.
How about all the fees that govt charges? A lot of the charges for telecommunications are govt fees and taxes–take a look at your bill.
Just take a look though at all the people who started out without much who have been able to start their own business and achieve financial independence, many of them immigrants but also many native born Americans. The opportunity is here for all.
So what specifically do you recommend instead of capitalism?
Sounds like they got ripped off to me. That Nissan should have fetched at least $6500 as a trade in…
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/2001/nissan/xterra/pricing/index.html
Didn’t the article say its current price is $5500? Maybe it was high mileage or something don’t know. And of course you get more if you sell it yourself than if you use it as a trade in.
so what you’re saying is that there’s potentially still an ‘01 Xterra at the dealership for $5995 that looks like it’s in pretty good condition? Gotta log off and head to VW of GG.
“One man’s trash is another man’s treasure” =)
The dealership was dishonest in telling the client what they were going to do with the car. They traded in the car with the impression it was going to be a participant in the ‘clunkers’ program and subsequently destroyed. They were misled. Is it a big deal? Yes. Although this car can still be used for transportation, the mission of the ‘clunkers’ program is to get rid of low-mileage vehicles and replace them with those of higher mileage. Not destroying this car after it was traded in for a better-mileage vehicle does not accomplish the goal of the ‘clunkers’ program. Personally, I think the ‘clunkers’ program is a dumb idea, but it is what it is.
A few weeks ago read about an incident in the German government cash for clunkers plan. Seems the old car that was supposed to be junked was re registered in Poland and later brought back to Germany and registered there, defeating the whole purpose.
I am certain the the convoluted “health plan” now being considered will have even more features useful to those who would game the system.
Enron came to be because of the “deregulation” of the electric power industry.
The recent financial problems were a direct result of ending the Glass_Steagall restrictions on the operations of commercial banks and the government driven effort to get unqualified buyers into houses that they could not afford.
The buyers are fools. They could have sold it on Craigslist for $4k or more - it’s still a perfectly fine car! Now they’re whining that a good car didn’t get destroyed? The wastefulness of humans never ceases to amaze me.
We wanted to use CforC and get the TDI wagon too, but they sold out all over soCal (we called around) and we didn’t want to settle for something else just to get the “free money.” So now our clunker (and it REALLY is a clunker - a rusty 1986 GMC Suburban on its last legs, it just takes up space in the driveway now) will get donated to a charity or sold to Pick-A-Part. No biggie, we’ll pick up a used TDI wagon in 2 years or so and save ourselves the immediate depreciation.
When you trade in your used car:
1) Why accept less than it is worth?, and
2) Why do you care whether the dealer sells it or destroys it? It’s his now.
How can we be sure that the dealers only get the reimbursements from the Fed for those clunker cars that were (or will be) actually destroyed? Who verified that all those cars were permanently disabled with the silicone injected into the engines? It is very tempting when the program involves tens of thousands of dollars per dealership.
I wonder if there are any cars under the real clunker progam ended up resold in the black market.
I agreed that the Xterra may be better off for a trade-in, but I also know that car dealers always try to maximize their profits, perhaps in this case legally.
It’s human nature - that, often times, they will try to give false impressions for their own benefits.
It is capiltalism at work, isn’t it?
A dishonest car dealer? wow, no way!
If the dealer offered Mr Dan an extra $200.00 for the 2001 nissan xterra , and asked him to trade in his car instead of junking it, he wouldn’t be upset and we will not have this article,
He is not concerned about the program, he is just upset because he didn’t know that his car is worth way more than $3500.00
This is Great. One of the most troubling aspects of the cash for clunkers program was the mandate that they destroy a perfectly good car for a cash credit. In this case their car was worth much more as a trade in so the dealer acted very responsibly by giving them an equivalent credit and hopefully making money off the trade in. They probably could have negotiated a higher trade in but we don’t know if the vehicle needed any reconditioning or repairs that may have factored in to the price. They weren’t ripped off they wanted a $3500 credit and they got it. They thought the dealer was scamming the government so they were correct in pointing this out but with more information the dealer is vindicated and alls well that ends well.
That’s to nice a car to get crushed.
Why is the seller being a troublemaker? Why was he so intent to have his trade-in destroyed when someone else would be willing to buy and drive it? Is there a selfish gene involved here or what? He got his $3500. Time to move on. What is he looking for out of this? More money? What am I missing here?
They were under the illusion that they were doing their bit for the environment when, if a previous poster is right, their new car only got 4 mpg more.
Sounded like they were trying to feel good about their environmentalism without really doing something significant.
But it does sound like the dealer was deceptive. The used car lot that sold me my car was very deceptive, lying about the mpg of my current vehicle but it still is supposed to get better gas mileage than their newer car. And the car that I had before was an 89 Corolla that I measured at 31-33 mpg average over all types of driving over about a year period years ago. But I like my car and am glad I have it. I plan to keep it for several more years.
If people really want to help the environment there are a bunch of cars now over 30 mpg and some of them are very reliable cars.
One other thought, if they were so environmentally conscious why did they buy an Xterra in the first place? Obviously buying an environmentally friendly vehicle was not a priority to them back then.
The dealer and the sales person lied to these people..These people will say anyrthing to sell a car..Dirtbag salesperson and sales manager. They should be fired….
Is anyone really surprised. Car dealers are the worst kind of criminals. They never say what they mean and never do what they say. So if they are talking they are lying and it will cost you money to associate with them in any way. Kind of like the untouchables in some societies.
Hoang’s complaint was forwarded to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration’s Enforcement and Justice Services Division, which told him this by email:
“I certainly appreciate your feelings with respect to the transaction you had purchasing your new car. Because the deal was not submitted to the CARS program for a rebate, we have no jurisdiction. However, you have the option of referring the issue to Attorney General’s office in California, or local authorities for review.”
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Your typical automated government response to anything. The dealer scammed these folks.
Trade in value is $6,500 said the blue book.
They should go back to the dealer and give them the $3,500 and get the car back and try to resale at retail price of $8,500.
or coerce the dealer for $3,000 more. or else simply take the dealer to small claims court.
I was mislead by Tustin Toyota in the same way. I went in with my 12 MPH, 10 year old Jeep. I was an original owner and had all the backup paperwork required by the CFC program; there was no possible question that they knew my intention. However, the paperwork ended up showing that they took my Jeep as a $4500 trade-in. As an older single women, I didn’t want to try to sell it on my own…but I also didn’t appreciate being tricked. Had they told me the truth - I could have purchased a used car and saved that initial ‘drive it off the lot’ loss. They knew they were sleezy and squirmed all over the place when I confronted them the morning after. You’d think that after 65 years I’d have know better - but shame on them!!
ppl are too funny, its not the dealers fault the original owners didnt bother to review the resale value of their car prior to seeing the dealer. the car has an ACV of $4300 on kbb.com, that means the owners should have waited till after cash for clunkers and bartered for a better deal.
i dont hear any THANKS to the thousands of dealers that fronted the $3,500-$4,500 rebate per vehicle while they were already in financial trouble so they can sell cars. these dealers had to wait months for compensation from the government - the whole program was a nightmare for dealers so more power to them if one was smart enough to keep some profit for themselves instead of uncle sam
the dealer has the right to keep the vehicle and not participate with the program on a purchase by purchase basis. this will be a common factor since it is up to the dealer if they want to submit the cash for clunker rebate.
the dealer did make a mistake by not informing the owner they want to keep their vehicle and not send it the chop shop but there is no legal recourse the owner can take, they got what they wanted and so did the dealer- END OF STORY!!! people like to always look at dealers and salespeople in this evil light when anythign happens
i do imagine the dealer will settle out of court if these typical orange countians fiel a lawsuit. but it only be to keep their dealer out of the spotlight and not give the OC register a chance to build this story in a negative aspect towards the dealer
PERHAPS THE DEALER SUBMITTED A DIFFERENT VEHICLE INSTEAD OF HOANG’S CAR, THERE IS A FRAUD??????
oh, dear oc! the staggering amazement that bellows inside me at your lack of thought, shall never cease. “it’s the feds, booo”… “it’s the private companies, boo”. in reality, it’s lack of thought on everyone’s part to think outside of the little orange box, you have built such a golden comfort in. maybe it’s our “almost” capitalist society, altogether??? hummmm. (get your stones ready) this was deception on the part of the dealer taking advantage of a pointless program with so many issues, the dealer felt it had the “right” to play it their way.(but knowing the sellers intention, deceived for the sale) this program was in response to the issues with the manufacturers, but because fed had hand in it- it was what it was. why chose which government can rule your life the best and think about a life without a government. or will that hurt your brains?
an honesty transplant. Government programs do not cheat you out of one dime. Its people that use government programs to cheat. It doesn’t matter what the intent of any programs is, there will be a class of people that will use it to make money. No programs guidelines can be written that closely. Its all about money, money, money, money.
They’ll be lucky if their identity isn’t stolen from the dealership as well.
The issue has to do with disclosure. If the dealer wanted to pay the money out of their own pocket, then they should have expressesly stated their intent to do so.
The couple went in to trade in their car specifically under the Cash For Clunkers program. If they knew beforehand the car wasn’t going to submitted, they may not have agreed to sell to the dealer in the first place.
This is a violation of contract and the dealer should face the ramifications.
Good job, dealership!
American values are not about wanton destruction - we’ll leave that to the communists.
Someday an antique car lover will thank you.
And the author whining about the ethics? Give me a break. If you cared a fig about the poor or middle class working families, you would want plenty of good used vehicles for them to drive.
How dare they make a reliable second-hand vehicle available for a low-income family to purchase!!! Where’s their compassion? Screw the poor, we have an agenda of hope, change, and unicorns to achieve!!
this guy is just trying to get his 15 minutes. He had to have signed everything that gave the dealership the car. If he is so mad then he should have read everything he was signing line by line. He still was given just as much as he would have if he was just trading it in. He wanted a new car and he got one. The dealership didn’t try to get any money back from the government. He should have known what he was talking about before he went crying to the paper. Its a good thing he didn’t cost anyone their jobs. It would have been even harder to find new work. If they would have done something work they would have been punished. They didn’t do anything wrong they maybe could have been clearer but you should never agree to or sign anything with out reading all of it.
Their car was worth $4700 as a trade-in. They should have checked KBB before they went to the dealer.
Good for the dealership! This is what this country is built on - free enterprise.
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“I suspect many people are being deceived,” said Bui.
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How exactly were you deceived, Bui? Did you not read the paperwork you were signing?
Some people are too stupid to drive. Bui is one of these people.
The fleecing of America continues… Next week, OBAMACARE.
Babies that will be born in the 200 years are glad this dealer saved them some money. This 3 billion dollar program was a joke, and if we had to pay for it now in cash, nobody would have voted for it, but since were passing it on to future babies, what the heck,let’s blow the money, and crush some cars that are still running.
I’m glad the dealer paid me 3500 for 96 explorer with 160,000 miles on it. Nothing worked anymore including anti lock brakes, new a/c,etc.What a pile of junk,but it was always garaged for the 13 yrs I owned it and still looked new. Hope you all don”t find this treasure on some dealers lot.
I wonder how many of the people who bought new cars under this program will lose their cars when they can’t make the payments? Hey, that can be a follow-up story in about 6 months.
I think they dealer should make it clear to the buyer in the first place that it’s not going to be a “cash for clunkers” program, but that it will be a trade-in. I guess they buyers were a bit upset that the dealer wasn’t being honest up front.
A foole, and his money are soone parted.
[1616 T. Draxe Adages 166]
Then they make it public?
I have a hard time believing Hoang and Bui traded it to save the planet. It’s not like they traded a Hummer. I think they had seller’s remorse when they found out it was worth more.
I wouldn’t be surprised the dealer did the “bait and switch” either to pay less.
Anyway you look at it these “free government money” programs only encourage rash decisions by lazy people who don’t do their homework.
Oh for pete’s sake, what’s the big deal? The dealer gave them 3500 trade-in value. The money ran out before all of the dealers got their paperwork in so maybe they decided not to bother filing and sold it. So what? There is no fraud going on here. One guy had it right on the news last night, by putting their car on the lot for 6000.00, maybe someone can afford to upgrade their car. Not everyone who had clunkers could get in on the deal since you only qualified if you took a brand new car. I couldn’t afford the payments on a new car, but I can on a 6000.00 dollar car. Maybe I’ll go buy the X-Terra….
The couple is ignorant. The environmental impact of destroying and throwing away their Xterra would be far worse than them driving away in it. So ridiculous. And also, we’re supposed to believe that you traded in your Xterra because of the “environmental goodness” of doing so, rather than you knew you’d get a $3500-$4500 discount off a new car? Please. You’re not fooling anyone. If you were so concerned about the environment and “doing your part” for the planet, you wouldn’t have been driving your gas guzzler in the first place.
Sounds more like a case of buyers remorse than anything else.
The dealer didn’t file paper for the CFC, didn’t get reimbursed from the gov’t for this car and i’d be willing to bet that their paperwork says nothing about CFC in regards to this sale.
They didn’t have to buy the car, they didn’t have to sign the paperwork and they could have driven home and done a little more research themselves. They can’t really blame the dealer for this one in my opinion. They didn’t do “due diligence” when buying a new car. Not the dealer’s fault.
That’s just wrong.
The people bringing in their clunkers are not looking for just $4500 or $3500. They’re looking for the money PLUS the knowledge that a gas guzzling vehicle is taken off the roads.
What VW gave was not the benefit of the bargain.
The Cash for Clunkers program is not for dealers to trick people to bring in cars for trade-ins.
HEY MRS BOLSAVIK:
Guess what… yes it was!!!
the guy went in for a diesel jetta and got a gas jetta? looks like bui just wanted to get a new car.
The Cash for Clunkers program is all about $$$ people. If you don’t understand that and think it was devised by the enviromentalists, you are mistaken.
People trade in their “clunkers”, cars that are worth less than the $3,500 rebate, and come out ahead. When you trade in something that is worth more than $3500, you LOSE! The car buyers in this case did just that and now they are upset. The dealer did not fully disclose that they were going to resell the SUV and should have told them that. But by selling it more than the $3500, they did the right thing. Saving the American taxypayer money and not destroying a perfectly good car.
This is an interesting story and should serve as another lesson to all car buyers out there. Do you homework and don’t cry when you if you get screwed.
THE AMERICAN CAR SALESMAN
The American car salesman is both hated and revered.
He is the last of a rare breed – the ultimate maverick.
He walks with confidence and takes offense at direction.
He cannot be left on his own, yet his spirit will not be dominated.
He is free enterprise personified.
The American automobile salesman laughs in the face of affirmative action. He is one of the few workers in society who is paid exactly what he is worth.
While the average person views an hourly wage as security, he disdains it as unnecessary limit on his ability to produce.
He hears negative responses every day, but has never learned the meaning of defeat.
He believes free enterprise was created with him in mind.
He has the instinct of the hunter, coupled with great compassion and kindness. He speaks eloquently and detects the most innocent untruth from his customers.
He would never bow his knee to any king or queen, but has the uncanny ability to treat his customers like royalty.
He is uniquely talented, endowed with savvy that cannot be taught in a classroom.
His spirit is what America was built on.
He is a loner who has difficulty walking in step with others, yet he gravitates towards those who are like him.
He is intensely competitive, nevertheless quick to give a helping hand to a struggling brother.
He is a dealer’s biggest liability, yet he is that same merchant’s greatest asset.
Some elements of society would like to eliminate him, but have found him to be indestructible.
Without his personality, his smile, his spirit, there would be a giant void in America.
I’m glad the XTerra wasn’t destroyed. They are cool cars. Plus, it was worth more than $3,500, but you can’t typically get in a trade-in what you would for a private sell. They are stupid if they think that they would actually be doing something good for the environment by destroying that car. Instead, the dealership is the hero to me. It makes it where someone like me can have a vehicle that I can actually afford. I can’t go out and buy a new car. I applaud that dealership for not costing us taxpayers (or rather future taxpayers since it was all financed by debt) one dime! Plus, someone like me is not deprived of the ability to buy a decent vehicle instead of a true clunker. Amen!