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	<title>Comments on: UCI study: &#8216;Egregious example of wasteful spending&#8217;</title>
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	<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/</link>
	<description>Your tax dollars at work.</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 24 Nov 2009 12:25:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: IPMan</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4712</link>
		<dc:creator>IPMan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 03:04:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4712</guid>
		<description>This is a bad time, especially for those unfortunately hit by the recession. First, the financial sector do us in. And then the auto-companies. I am sure many are ready to trigger-ready to shoot down more 'culprits.'

But I am sad to see Sen Coburn took this opportunity to point fingers at well thought-out research. And anti-pseudo, I am sure he is a patriot, but so is Sarah Palin. And patriot of all kinds can display shocking level of insight or insults.

It is time for Americans to come together to examine the wastage generated by our traditional industries, e.g. auto and finance. But to point fingers at research and Internet industry is a egregiously suicidal attempt to kill the real American strength in innovation and inventiveness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a bad time, especially for those unfortunately hit by the recession. First, the financial sector do us in. And then the auto-companies. I am sure many are ready to trigger-ready to shoot down more &#8216;culprits.&#8217;</p>
<p>But I am sad to see Sen Coburn took this opportunity to point fingers at well thought-out research. And anti-pseudo, I am sure he is a patriot, but so is Sarah Palin. And patriot of all kinds can display shocking level of insight or insults.</p>
<p>It is time for Americans to come together to examine the wastage generated by our traditional industries, e.g. auto and finance. But to point fingers at research and Internet industry is a egregiously suicidal attempt to kill the real American strength in innovation and inventiveness.</p>
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		<title>By: Autopoietic</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4700</link>
		<dc:creator>Autopoietic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 00:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4700</guid>
		<description>The Senator is quoting a clearly misleading article, that has skewed the interview quotes from Prof. Nardi. The article is replete with interpretation and speculation, and is loose about choosing its quotations. 

Online cultures are spreading by the second, resulting in innovations and rich practices. Why are more and more kids and adults alike spending so much time playing games? What is the value of these games? If millions of players are spending multiple hours on Second Life or WoW, creating avatars, scripting objects, hiring players to represent them, and companies are showing commerical interest by opening up stores and conducting conferences in these worlds, the world had better pay attention to this phenomenon. Online communities are new ways of thinking about incorporating play at work, aimed at stimulating employees and increasing productivity. Online communities provide respite. It is crucial to study the economies, societies and cultures formed in these worlds for the development of better computer science applications. Turning a blind eye to games and online worlds is to regress in next-generation interfaces. Turning a blind eye to games and internet is to be ignorant about phenomena that are changing the way we live. The internet has clearly seeped into millions of lives in ways unimaginable. It takes an anthropologist/computer scientist to uncover these worlds. Science, by definition, is concerned about how the world works and deriving understandings of it. Online worlds are as real as physical worlds. 

Prof. Nardi's research in particular examines such areas as creativity, learning, motivation, and collaboration in WoW, to name a few. The findings of this research are valuable in the study and analysis of internet, education, social behaviour, work, and more broadly in understanding a major social revolution. Quoting one of her papers, "relations in World of Warcraft make the game more fun and engender a flexible learning space. Loneliness, lack of social support, and increased immobility have been shown to lead to depression in the elderly [22]. A game such as World of Warcraft tailored to the interests of various segments of the elderly population would enable them to make new friends online from their own homes, in the context of an exciting, challenging game with rich content. The game would provide mental stimulation and topics of mutual interest." Quoting another, "Learning in conversation in World of Warcraft is erratic, spontaneous, contextual, and driven by small events. It is enlivened by playful, lightweight emotions. Such learning can support simple fact finding, the development of tactics and strategy, and the working out of a moral order."

I think most people here are getting the wrong end of the stick, thanks for a bad job at journalism and a senator who found the article a convenient reference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Senator is quoting a clearly misleading article, that has skewed the interview quotes from Prof. Nardi. The article is replete with interpretation and speculation, and is loose about choosing its quotations. </p>
<p>Online cultures are spreading by the second, resulting in innovations and rich practices. Why are more and more kids and adults alike spending so much time playing games? What is the value of these games? If millions of players are spending multiple hours on Second Life or WoW, creating avatars, scripting objects, hiring players to represent them, and companies are showing commerical interest by opening up stores and conducting conferences in these worlds, the world had better pay attention to this phenomenon. Online communities are new ways of thinking about incorporating play at work, aimed at stimulating employees and increasing productivity. Online communities provide respite. It is crucial to study the economies, societies and cultures formed in these worlds for the development of better computer science applications. Turning a blind eye to games and online worlds is to regress in next-generation interfaces. Turning a blind eye to games and internet is to be ignorant about phenomena that are changing the way we live. The internet has clearly seeped into millions of lives in ways unimaginable. It takes an anthropologist/computer scientist to uncover these worlds. Science, by definition, is concerned about how the world works and deriving understandings of it. Online worlds are as real as physical worlds. </p>
<p>Prof. Nardi&#8217;s research in particular examines such areas as creativity, learning, motivation, and collaboration in WoW, to name a few. The findings of this research are valuable in the study and analysis of internet, education, social behaviour, work, and more broadly in understanding a major social revolution. Quoting one of her papers, &#8220;relations in World of Warcraft make the game more fun and engender a flexible learning space. Loneliness, lack of social support, and increased immobility have been shown to lead to depression in the elderly [22]. A game such as World of Warcraft tailored to the interests of various segments of the elderly population would enable them to make new friends online from their own homes, in the context of an exciting, challenging game with rich content. The game would provide mental stimulation and topics of mutual interest.&#8221; Quoting another, &#8220;Learning in conversation in World of Warcraft is erratic, spontaneous, contextual, and driven by small events. It is enlivened by playful, lightweight emotions. Such learning can support simple fact finding, the development of tactics and strategy, and the working out of a moral order.&#8221;</p>
<p>I think most people here are getting the wrong end of the stick, thanks for a bad job at journalism and a senator who found the article a convenient reference.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti pseudo intellectual</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4662</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti pseudo intellectual</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:14:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4662</guid>
		<description>In a follow-up to my post I incorrectly directed a comment to Mr. Bailey, with whom in fact I agree, and not the staff writer Teri Sforza.  My apologies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In a follow-up to my post I incorrectly directed a comment to Mr. Bailey, with whom in fact I agree, and not the staff writer Teri Sforza.  My apologies.</p>
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		<title>By: anteater</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4660</link>
		<dc:creator>anteater</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:14:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4660</guid>
		<description>@ Kimi and others...

Grants like this actually free up funds to reinvest in the university and/or reduce the tax burden.  A study like this (I'm not sure of the particulars of this one) would maybe employ 2-3 grad students (the grant pays their tuition and stipend, rather than coming out of UCI's budget) and partially fund the researcher.

Additionally, within sociology, anthropology, and computer science, this study is incredibly useful.  Within sociology specifically, there's a growing interest, especially at UCI, in social networks.  And in the current era of computers and Internet, virtual networks are vital to our everyday lives and critically under-studied.  Examining networks and social interactions via WoW could yield important information about how these computer-based networks are emerging and evolving.

$100,000 may seem like a lot of money, but compared to the overall budget, it's small potatoes (my department spends $30,000 in photocopying and printing in a year), and the payoff is much greater than the cost.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Kimi and others&#8230;</p>
<p>Grants like this actually free up funds to reinvest in the university and/or reduce the tax burden.  A study like this (I&#8217;m not sure of the particulars of this one) would maybe employ 2-3 grad students (the grant pays their tuition and stipend, rather than coming out of UCI&#8217;s budget) and partially fund the researcher.</p>
<p>Additionally, within sociology, anthropology, and computer science, this study is incredibly useful.  Within sociology specifically, there&#8217;s a growing interest, especially at UCI, in social networks.  And in the current era of computers and Internet, virtual networks are vital to our everyday lives and critically under-studied.  Examining networks and social interactions via WoW could yield important information about how these computer-based networks are emerging and evolving.</p>
<p>$100,000 may seem like a lot of money, but compared to the overall budget, it&#8217;s small potatoes (my department spends $30,000 in photocopying and printing in a year), and the payoff is much greater than the cost.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti pseudo intellectual</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4658</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti pseudo intellectual</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:02:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4658</guid>
		<description>Dr. J.A. your pontificating about the merits of research would almost be eloquent, if it were not for the fact that your arguments defies common sense, even if you do have a "Dr." in front of your initials. 

Those who feel strongly about the merits of researching gamers, are free to do, this is America after all.  The assertion though that taxpayers should foot the bill, when people are loosing their homes, going to food banks, and millions go without health care is just grotesque, and shows a disconnect with reality by the "research community" which you profess to represent.  

Also Mr. Bailey, I am neither a republican or a conservative, but any senator who exposes this kind of waste in government should be called a patriot, and not controversial.  Controversial would not be so "controversial" if your journalism were more balanced, and not hint that someone has a negative character flaw because you disagree with them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dr. J.A. your pontificating about the merits of research would almost be eloquent, if it were not for the fact that your arguments defies common sense, even if you do have a &#8220;Dr.&#8221; in front of your initials. </p>
<p>Those who feel strongly about the merits of researching gamers, are free to do, this is America after all.  The assertion though that taxpayers should foot the bill, when people are loosing their homes, going to food banks, and millions go without health care is just grotesque, and shows a disconnect with reality by the &#8220;research community&#8221; which you profess to represent.  </p>
<p>Also Mr. Bailey, I am neither a republican or a conservative, but any senator who exposes this kind of waste in government should be called a patriot, and not controversial.  Controversial would not be so &#8220;controversial&#8221; if your journalism were more balanced, and not hint that someone has a negative character flaw because you disagree with them.</p>
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		<title>By: Xenophobia</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4656</link>
		<dc:creator>Xenophobia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:01:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4656</guid>
		<description>...and there are 20M players worldwide, 10M of them are in China.  At $15/month, and $40 per software package (Yeah, I'm sure a huge portion of the software is pirated in China and elsewhere) that's a lot of taxes Blizzard is paying.  A lot more than the $100K.
$15 x 20M players x 12 months = $3.6B  per year
Their gross profit was $955M last year.
What's the corporate tax rate?  35%
That's.... ....$348M they paid in taxes last year.
So, it's worthwhile to the company and to the government to study and encourage that income stream.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;and there are 20M players worldwide, 10M of them are in China.  At $15/month, and $40 per software package (Yeah, I&#8217;m sure a huge portion of the software is pirated in China and elsewhere) that&#8217;s a lot of taxes Blizzard is paying.  A lot more than the $100K.<br />
$15 x 20M players x 12 months = $3.6B  per year<br />
Their gross profit was $955M last year.<br />
What&#8217;s the corporate tax rate?  35%<br />
That&#8217;s&#8230;. &#8230;.$348M they paid in taxes last year.<br />
So, it&#8217;s worthwhile to the company and to the government to study and encourage that income stream.</p>
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		<title>By: Xenophobia</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4654</link>
		<dc:creator>Xenophobia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 20:40:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4654</guid>
		<description>While the subject of the study seems frivolous, the results are valuable.  As we do more and more business with China, we need to understand the market.  Let's keep in mind just how much money online gaming takes in.  It is one of the few trade items that contributes to our positive balance of trade, without consuming any resources.
And if we wish to exploit the Chinese market, we need to understand it well.   This study will contribute to that end.
Just as the "Search for extraterrestrial life" yields indirect benefits in terms of offshoot technology.  
Oh, and the largest employer (by far) in Arkansas: the government.
Look to the upcoming "Public works" planned by the new administration for wasteful spending.  You can expect many "Bridges to Nowhere."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While the subject of the study seems frivolous, the results are valuable.  As we do more and more business with China, we need to understand the market.  Let&#8217;s keep in mind just how much money online gaming takes in.  It is one of the few trade items that contributes to our positive balance of trade, without consuming any resources.<br />
And if we wish to exploit the Chinese market, we need to understand it well.   This study will contribute to that end.<br />
Just as the &#8220;Search for extraterrestrial life&#8221; yields indirect benefits in terms of offshoot technology.<br />
Oh, and the largest employer (by far) in Arkansas: the government.<br />
Look to the upcoming &#8220;Public works&#8221; planned by the new administration for wasteful spending.  You can expect many &#8220;Bridges to Nowhere.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: John Gault</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4652</link>
		<dc:creator>John Gault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 20:25:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4652</guid>
		<description>The US Federal Budget approaches 3,000 Billion and this genius in congress can only seem to find 1.3 Billion in questionable expenditures?  Really?  

Blizzard Entertainment is one of the leaders in the gaming universe, employs 2500+ people, generates 1 Billion plus revenue and has found a way to captivate for than 10 million people with their games.

The gaming environment seems completely worth studying.  

and to @whitejasminetea above, I could not agree more. . .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The US Federal Budget approaches 3,000 Billion and this genius in congress can only seem to find 1.3 Billion in questionable expenditures?  Really?  </p>
<p>Blizzard Entertainment is one of the leaders in the gaming universe, employs 2500+ people, generates 1 Billion plus revenue and has found a way to captivate for than 10 million people with their games.</p>
<p>The gaming environment seems completely worth studying.  </p>
<p>and to @whitejasminetea above, I could not agree more. . .</p>
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		<title>By: Teri Sforza, Register staff writer</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4650</link>
		<dc:creator>Teri Sforza, Register staff writer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 20:18:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4650</guid>
		<description>Fl Lee Bailey - I called the senator controversial because he enrages a lot of people, and has been nicknamed "Dr. No" in the Senate. See his efforts to block the year-end, last-minute rush of legislation at The Oklahoman (http://coburn.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=LatestNews.NewsStories&#38;ContentRecord_id=b03a74e4-802a-23ad-4845-6ad0f8dbfd2f&#38;Issue_id=) and efforts to block Bush's global AIDS bill, etc. He's quite a colorful character, no question that he's controversial, and I'm sorry controversial has become such a controversial word.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fl Lee Bailey - I called the senator controversial because he enrages a lot of people, and has been nicknamed &#8220;Dr. No&#8221; in the Senate. See his efforts to block the year-end, last-minute rush of legislation at The Oklahoman (http://coburn.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=LatestNews.NewsStories&amp;ContentRecord_id=b03a74e4-802a-23ad-4845-6ad0f8dbfd2f&amp;Issue_id=) and efforts to block Bush&#8217;s global AIDS bill, etc. He&#8217;s quite a colorful character, no question that he&#8217;s controversial, and I&#8217;m sorry controversial has become such a controversial word.</p>
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		<title>By: Kimi</title>
		<link>http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/2008/12/29/uci-study-egregious-example-of-wasteful-spending/6620/#comment-4648</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 20:01:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taxdollars.freedomblogging.com/?p=6620#comment-4648</guid>
		<description>THAT MUCH MONEY??? to study the people playing games... to better understand humans..... I agree with Mick , why not spend money to understand why the hell do people spend money on things like that!

sorry, but from my perspective, I'm young, I'm a potential UCI student, and right now not only are my parents causing me financial aid problems, but this news just sucks. with the recession and what not, I think it would have been wiser to help out the students and their educations especially since it's had major cuts in funding.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>THAT MUCH MONEY??? to study the people playing games&#8230; to better understand humans&#8230;.. I agree with Mick , why not spend money to understand why the hell do people spend money on things like that!</p>
<p>sorry, but from my perspective, I&#8217;m young, I&#8217;m a potential UCI student, and right now not only are my parents causing me financial aid problems, but this news just sucks. with the recession and what not, I think it would have been wiser to help out the students and their educations especially since it&#8217;s had major cuts in funding.</p>
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